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Lisen801
15th Sep 2010, 2:27 PM
I have made a new door but the hinge placement is not really good. My door has a different width than the cloned door so it does not look good when it is opened. Is it possible to change the "swing-center" in any way. I've been looking in RIG-resource s3pe but not found anything.

cmomoney
15th Sep 2010, 2:43 PM
They're in the RIG, the names are bind_0_doorSwing, and bind_0_doorSwing_double.

Lisen801
15th Sep 2010, 5:57 PM
cmomoney...

Hmm .. You have helped me so much so I almost feel ashamed to ask you for more.
I've been looking in RIG-resource and found _bind_0_doorSwing. But what do I really edit? I have tried to change position, but I see no difference. The original values (X, Y, Z) is 0; 0; 0. I would like to have the swing-center 0.814; 0; 534 so I enter the values. But no difference!

I think the values of the swing center of the cloned door originally is about 1: 0; 0.5 - See picture.

There are also values for the Orientation and I have worked with values there as well but noticed no difference in the game.

cmomoney
15th Sep 2010, 7:12 PM
Move the bind_0_doorSwing_double bone. You should only have to change the x and z values.

Lisen801
15th Sep 2010, 9:01 PM
I managed to change the swing center by edit the X and Z positions in the resource bind_0_doorSwing_double bone. But a new problem arose. The entire door was moved. I would have to edit the distance "?" in any way.

atavera
16th Sep 2010, 3:47 PM
Try updating the position of the joint in the SKIN block of your MODL/MLODs

Lisen801
17th Sep 2010, 4:19 PM
No luck so far! Someone know how to fix this?
Please...

Inge Jones
17th Sep 2010, 5:15 PM
Nope, we're waiting for you to do all the pioneering and then write the tutorial :D

Lisen801
17th Sep 2010, 5:19 PM
Ha, ha...
So this is an mission impossible?

Inge Jones
17th Sep 2010, 5:26 PM
I would expect that it is very possible indeed - someone just needs the patience to experiment with lots of different combinations of settings till it looks like it's all going in the right direction. I last played with pivot points in Sims 2, and they were usually relative to some other point. You may have to find and move that other point instead or as well as the hinge.

Lisen801
17th Sep 2010, 5:52 PM
Oh yes, moving the hinges was rather easy (when you know how to do it, thanks cmomoney) but then.... There's soooo many resources and numbers....!!
I like modelling and texturing not all that numbers, groups, joints, etc! I'm certainly no programmer

Thank you.

cmomoney
18th Sep 2010, 12:32 AM
You may have to do as atavera said and update the SKINs in the MLOD and MODL, but before you assign the joints in Milkshape.

Lisen801
18th Sep 2010, 11:12 AM
You may have to do as atavera said and update the SKINs in the MLOD and MODL, but before you assign the joints in Milkshape.

Hmm... is there some info somewhere how to manage that? What's SKINs?
I've been searching the MLOD and MODL but don't found anything.

Inge Jones
19th Sep 2010, 3:18 PM
I am pretty sure they're called the same in s3pe also?

cmomoney
19th Sep 2010, 3:42 PM
I posted before I was done. :faceslap:

In TSRW, it's under Skin Info in the Mesh tab. Each group has one and you'll have to change the ones that include the bone(will be fnv32 hash of name). haven't tried it in TSRW, so I can't say it works

In s3pe, you' have to look in the groups to see where the SKINs are. If you open a MLOD/MODL with the value button and scroll down, you'll see each group. In each group you'll see "Skin: 0x10000008", for example, this is where that SKIN is . Under that is the names of the joints, so if you see the bone you're trying to change there, you'll need to go to there in Grid: ChunkEntries->[#skin reference]ChunkEntries->RCOLBlock->Joints->Joints->joint you want to move->TransformMatrix. You have to change each SKIN with that bone in it.

The positions are also inverted.

Lisen801
19th Sep 2010, 9:30 PM
After a full day of working with all of the joints and bones along with everything else so I've finally got a working door that looks good in the game. Many thanks atavera, cmomoney and Inge for helping me!

Simsimillian
24th Feb 2011, 7:38 PM
I'm stuck :(
I can follow up to the point where editing the bind_0_doorSwing_double moves the entire door a little to the right (instead of just the swing center), but then...

I thought it was the joint I had to edit, and not the bone (because it's the swing center, right?) but I scanned all my MLODs and MODL in SIMPE and there is no mention of either the word joint or the joint names (0xAA0DC6B5 and another one)

(I also tried editing the X value of bind_0_doorSwing in the opposite direction but apparently I can't put in a negative value there and it's already at zero...)

:help:

PS: I am editing a fridge, not a door

Simsimillian
28th Feb 2011, 9:06 AM
Ok. After a few more days of frustration I think I have tried anything I could think of.
1. I tried editing the values for double door swing in the .rig - this moved the entire door, but not the joint (pivot point)
2. I tried looking for the SKIN info in the MLODs in SimPe - this is nowhere to be found
3. I DID find this skin info in TSRW and changed the values there - this moves the entire door, but not the joint (pivot point)
4. intrigued by this vv

You may have to do as atavera said and update the SKINs in the MLOD and MODL, but before you assign the joints in Milkshape.

... I checked to see wether changing the .rig file would change the position of the joints in my Milkshape model, in other words wether editing the .rig would influence the MLOD. It didn't.
5. Editing the SKIN info in TSRW DID change the MLOD, because the joint did appear in a different location when I open the MLOD in Milkshape afterwards. But even then, when tested in game, the point of rotation has not moved.
6. I tried editing the SKIN values in TSRW, then extracting the MLODS, opening them in Milkshape, and un- and re-assigning all vertices to the joints in question. After testing in game, the door has moved, yet the point of rotation stays, defiantly, where it has always been.

I think I'm going to give up now, unless there is someone out there who is willing to shine a little light on this. I'd really like to know how the OP got past this problem :(

cmomoney
28th Feb 2011, 12:33 PM
What fridge are you using?

Simsimillian
28th Feb 2011, 8:05 PM
thank you so much for replying!
I used the cheap one, valuefridge. Could that be a reason?

What exactly did you mean by *before* assigning the joints in Milkshape?
Because today was thinking maybe you meant that I ought to unassign all vertices, export without bone assignments, recompile, import in SimPe, save, then edit the joint locations before I export the MLOD again and decompile this one for bone assignment in Milkshape...
The reason for this is that I have no idea of what is stored in the MLOD, and that maybe I could thus 'reset' it or something...

(I ought not be fretting about this during class, lol)

atavera
1st Mar 2011, 2:57 AM
Hi Simsimillian, to see more of what is inside the MLOD you can get the latest S3PE QA (http://dino.drealm.info/den/denforum/index.php?topic=479.0) , and unzip the extra plugins (http://code.google.com/p/s3pi-wrappers/downloads/detail?name=s3pi-wrappers-20110223a.7z&can=2&q=) into your s3pe folder.

With that, you should see the bones in the MLOD/MODL in S3PE's Grid View.

Alternatively it looks like TSRW can edit the bone positions for the MLOD/MODL, but I don't have any experience with that.

From what I can tell the positions need to be updated in all of the MLODs, MODL, and RIG for any bones(a.k.a. joints) that have vertices assigned to them.

Simsimillian
1st Mar 2011, 7:35 AM
Thanks Atavera, but I already have those. Unless the joints are hiding under a different name, they don't appear in the grid in SimPe. There is no mention of 'joints' or 'bones' or their names.
I DID edit the bones in TSRW, and like I said, this moved the entire door but not the point of rotation.

Inge Jones
1st Mar 2011, 8:14 AM
I don't think SimPE can load Sims 3 objects.

Simsimillian
1st Mar 2011, 8:17 AM
Of course I meant S3pe ;)

Simsimillian
1st Mar 2011, 12:08 PM
*Major Insight!* :beer:

I finally solved it! The crucial info I couldn't find anywhere but finally managed to deduct is as follows:

1. The joint information in the SKINs determines the location of the rotation point in relation to its assigned vertices (aka the door). This is important because in case of the fridge door, it doesn't rotate on its very edge like a normal door, but a little bit inward to compensate for the fridge door's thickness.
2. The joint information in the RIG file (aka _bind_0_door_W_double) determines the location of the rotation point in relation to the rest of the object. So this is the virtual hinge.

Since I had mistakenly gathered from what I had read that the RIG and the SKIN's were two ways of achieving the same goal, I only edited either one or the other, hence moving my door all over the place in seemingly random ways. I only found out because on a whim, I decided to check the RIG after editing the joint info in the SKINS in TSRW and found it unaffected by my change.

(I am writing all this here because I don't think this info is anywhere else on the forum, and if there are people out there who are searching like me, I think these are very important clarifications)

I still don't understand the significance of the "before assigning the joints in Milkshape" because that didn't seem to matter.

Some other weird thing I found (but I guess this is off topic) is that after I edited my object in TSRW once (and I had to because I couldn't find the SKIN info I needed in S3pe), after every following change in S3pe (like say editing the RIG), I have to run the object through TSRW => sims3pack => delphy's multi-installer => s3pe => save as again or my object refuses to show up in game. Also my STBL files seem to have doubled for some weird reason. This isn't a problem that can't be overcome, as I just cited the solution, but it's a bit tedious and at least very random. :wtf:

I can't believe this has filled the best part of my week with frustration. I almost cried when I saw my door pivoting where it's supposed to. Maybe I'm too soft for all this sims stuff :p

Inge Jones
1st Mar 2011, 12:11 PM
You probably need atavera's wrappers if you don't already have them. The native wrappers probably don't have a chunk handler for SKIN, but atavera's do.

Simsimillian
1st Mar 2011, 12:28 PM
It's odd, but I do have the ones he linked me to in his last post.
But I guess I'll just use both programs (s3pe and TSRW) since they both have their advantages.

Inge Jones
1st Mar 2011, 12:33 PM
I have a little tutorial you might find helpful, if you want to use both tools on one project: http://dino.drealm.info/den/denforum/index.php?topic=488.0

Simsimillian
1st Mar 2011, 1:29 PM
thanks! :)

edit: I tried it, and it is a life saver - thanks again! :bunny: