If a some part is deleted from a mesh in milkshape, example this bow of an apron from maid's dress, will that destroy the mesh's boneassigments, and morphs? Is that possible to do?

You would have to remove it from every morph state and probably have to close up the hole it makes, something like that would be very easy to do.

I could fix all the bows off from the LODs and from the morphstates but how can I get the morphs of the maid dress into milkshape so I could edit them?

EDIT: I suppose of course extracting the files with S3PE but which are exactly the morphstate files? All the BGEO, thin,fit,fat files only? Do I need more than these files to get the whole maidoutfit and its LODs modded so it wont have the bow ?
Thanks alot for any advice

Edit...: soo I just noticed that the Frenchmaidoutfit's LOD1 and Morph fit/fat/thin LOD1 are missing one finger... and it is as LOD 1_2. So since I am supposed to make new morphstates after bow remove edit how am I going to include that morph's lod 1_2 when Cmar's morphmaker only has slots for LODs 1,2 and 3.

Oh please, anyone with the knowledge, help me out, I'll be ever so grateful. These constant problems are tearing my brains apart.

You'll need to extract the morphs from FullBuild0 to edit them in Milkshape - look for nameofusualmeshfile_lodx_fat, etc. I'm not sure how morphs for meshes with several parts work,. so I'll leave that up to Bloom, who seems to know all.

You normally should edit all the morphs and build new Bgeo(slider) files, best done with TSRW....
However,
deleting verts or faces will not have effect on the morphs so in your case you can delete the bow
you can then close the gap by snappin the vertices back together(be carefull you dont snap the faces!)
But since each vertice is numbered(numbering is used on the sliderfiles) you do need to edit the snapped vertices or you still will have a gap ingame.
You can edit the verts with Wes his extra data tool and give the ones you snapped a identical number(just copy one of the excisting ones and past it in the other boxes)
Also check the boneassignements, they have to be identical also!
And last, fix the uvmap,

Its not how it should be done, but it will work.
I did once mod the maid outfit and removed the bow and gave it a upskirt look, its on the adult site.

I also had idea if I could just weld that LOD1_2 finger into the LOD1 mesh to make it full (so I wouldn't need LOD1_2 at all) - wouldn't that remain with the boneassigments, and if not the finger's boneassigment should be easy to fix to identical? Then of course also weld the missing finger into all the morphstates (so they have identical vertex count) making those meshes into new Bgeo files. Could that work too?

Right - you need to edit the morph meshes (_fat, _fit, _thin, maybe _special, special is pregnant) by loading the base mesh in Milkshape first, then import the morphs over it. They will show up as groups under the base mesh in the groups tab.

Edit all of them making sure you do the exact same edit to each.

Then use Wes's Autonum tool to renumber all the meshes. Starting vertex numbers for LOD1 are 5000 for tops and bodies, 15000 for bottoms. Make a note of the next vertex number after LOD1 is done and that becomes the starting vertex number for LOD2. The same way, LOD2's next vertex number is starting number for LOD3.

When you export, you'll export the base and then each morph. Name them appropriately so you can identify them.

Then run MorphMaker and load in your LODs for one of the morphs. You'll see there are three slots for each LOD - those are for the mesh and any LOD1_2 and so on additional meshes, up to three meshes for each LOD. (Maybe you thought the three slots were for fat, fit, thin? No, each morph state has to be done separately.)

Fill in a project name (MyNewClothing_fat, etc., whatever) and click the arrow button to generate an instance number.

Click the Clothing button and click to make a BGEO. (Name it so you can identify it later.)

When you have all three or four morphs, click the Add Morphs to Package button and select your custom clothing package. Load up each BGEO and save as a new package, and MorphMaker will link them up to replace the original morphs.

And you're done.

I hear it's easier in TSRW, which I don't use - Bloom can explain that method.

*(Maybe you thought the three slots were for fat, fit, thin?)*

Yea that is what I thought. But now I know better

Thanks for all for helping me out! I'll try this method right away

I do recommend TSRW for beginners(still hoping CTU/BBM and the GEOM plugins will merge one day tho )

You do need to install TSRW and its MS plugins.
You clone the maid outfit and extract the mesh(lod1)
The base mesh and morphs are in one file
Import it in MS
Make your edits to the meshes and export.
On import back in TSRW the meshes will be auto renumbered and new Bgeo files will be generated.

Keep in mind that this method/modding will only work when deleting/editing existing faces and vertices.
You can not add stuff, like new meshparts.(it will break the morphdata.)
You need to use a diffrent process to do that(use a 2 group outfit and load the seperate parts in each meshgroup)

Thanks bloom, I really should learn how to use TSWR also so I can try that out with morph making too.

Can anyone tell me if there are LOD3 fat/fit/thin geoms for French maidoutfit so I can edit the morphs of LOD3 too. I searched all the maid files in s3pe. but it doesn't have that file. The CTU does extract LOD3 for the base mesh so I can't understand why there isn't one for Fat/fit/thin. Should I then use LOD2 meshes also for LOD3 base and morphs?

Unless you play zoomed out or your computer sucks your game will NEVER use LOD3, so yea you can. When I make custom meshes I usually only make very high and high meshes and use the high mesh to fill in the blanks. But thats just me.

Dude, just use TSRW, something like removing the bow on an outfit is really easy and should take no time at all, assuming you know what you're doing that is. TSRW makes thing SO much easier. I wouldn't use S3PE for a meshing job, modding or default replacement sure, meshing no.

Have to agree with Omega, if your a beginner use TSRW,
I never use S3PE for extracting the meshes but use Postal(when using CTU or update a existing package)

But if your going to upload your creations you definatly want to include/update all 3 lods!!

So kind of managed to do this but its not working well.
I did this in Cmar's way since I insist using CTU - at least now since I learned using all these programs.

But as I tested, the fat morph makes the mesh look like that, (see attached pic) shapes go odd from leg and back of the skirt, and in the skinny one the skirt. Fit one seemed to look ok.

It's as if those few vertexes are stuck and wont move along with the morphs

I didn't do any edit to the mesh more than deleted the bow and since it is seperated part removing it did not even leave any gap into the actual dress mesh. And I did exactly same edits for all the morphs (when I tested importing the bowles meshes and morphs into MS it worked fine with same vertex count.)

Anyhow this is how I continued:
*used autonum tool on the save file that has LOD1 and all it's morphs.
*used autonum tool on save file that has lod2 and nd all it's morphs. (with the next Starting vertex numbers)
*Then I used autonom tool on the lod3 etc, but the lod too I used the same meshes I used for lod2 as I couldn't find the lod 3 morphs
*Imported the base meshes in CTU to make it into new package.
*Used morphmaker to create seperate Bgeos (using also that finger mesh for Lod1_2)
* and then added all the BGEOS into the CTU's package file and saved it as new package.


Is this problem fixable?

The mistake you made is that the numbering is done on the lod1 and lod1_1
So you number the base mesh and the morphs and write down the following number.
Export
start new and import the fingers and its morphs
Use autonumtool again and start with the number you wrote down.
Export

With the lod2 you start over again, same way.

edit,
If you cant find the meshes use Postal, it has the option to show the nMapnames, so you can search for the meshname.
After ticking the nMapnames in the tool menu you can hit the names tab to put them in alphabetical order.

Nice catch, Bloom! I didn't even think of the lod1_2 mesh messing up the numbering.

I searched the base LOD3 fit/fat/thin geom but as S3PE didn't show it neather did the postal (it does show lod3 fit/fat/thin for other meshes, as I check out but not for maid) Now I also checked out TSRW, and as I selected frenchmaid outfit, and made it show LOD3 - moving the thin/fat slider doesn't change the body at all. I'm pretty sure now that maid LOD3 for fit/fat/thin just doesn't exist.

In this case, should I just use base mesh LOD3 for maid outfit without morph like EA does, and only make the new morphs for lod1 and 2- or use lod2's mesh also as lod3? (since I do want to make things right after all)

Edit: Oh and Cmar, can you tell what is the starting vertex number for lod2 and 3 since if I understood right what bloom ment, I should not continue using the vertext number on lod2 from lod1_2 but start over on that. (is it still 5000?)

Thanks so far

You don't really need morphs for LOD3. If you're zoomed out far enough to see LOD3 then you can't see any detail, just a blob - it's used mainly when you're just slightly zoomed in from map view, when you can "see" sims but only as vague moving dots.

You are right about the lod3, i am sorry...
I still have them for the toponly i made but must have made them from the basemesh i guess(dont remember)

Unfortunate you do need them to build the Bgeo files so you best:
Import the lod3 mesh in Milkshape
duplicate it 4 times
Unassigne the boneassignements
fix the comments
export them as morphs(you decide if you scale them a bit)
The gaps on neck and feet wont be visible when zooming out.

And yes, you start over with 5000 when you autonum the lod2 and lod2_1

Alright, it works perfectly! Even though I do not have the morphs for LOD3, but I am willing to make it of course if that is reaally neccessary.

Since Whiterider's opinion it's not a must and Bloom says I should make them, So for the last question: Does the game result into crashing or anything very serious if I leave maid dress lod3 without morphs? I test played with the bowless dress and so far it worked fine. But since I am going to upload, when I retexture the dress, I want to be sure not to share a borked up mesh to anyone.

I asume you created new sliderfiles with BMM?
Been a while since i used it but if it accepts only the lod3 without the morphs then you might not need them?
Cmar will know

If the game doesn't crash when zooming out on the outfit it might work.

1 - The vertex numbers need to run continuously from lod1 through lod3, including any 'extra' meshes for each lod. In this case, I guess the best method would be to start at 5000 with lod1, continue with lod1_2, then with lod2, etc.

2 - I believe you can safely leave out lod3 from MorphMaker.

What happens is that the BGEO file contains a starting vertex number, the number of vertices for each lod, a list of offsets to the next vertex, and a list of morph information. It doesn't specifically identity vertex IDs after that first vertex, it just goes down the list. That's why the vertices have to be in order with no duplicates or gaps and run continuously through the lods. If you have no lod3 morph information, it'll just have zero number of vertices.

i disagree on that.
I am sure you have to start over on the lod2 mesh with 5000 again.
And again on the lod3, its how i made all my meshes.

Because if you dont it is possible you end up in the verticenumber range of a bottom/top/shoe or hair mesh.(especially on a higher polygon mesh)

Well I finally got this mesh done, Thank you all for the great help!

You're right - the BGEO headers contain the starting vertex number for each lod and I didn't realize the game can handle overlap.

However, unless you're working with a very high poly mesh there's no reason you HAVE to start over. Personally I prefer to do it the way the game does it and use one continuous set of numbers.