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2018 MTS Calendar Contest - posted on 12th Nov 2017 at 8:48 PM
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world renowned whogivesafuckologist
staff: retired moderator
Original Poster
#1 Old 23rd Mar 2008 at 1:49 AM
Default Flashing Blue Accessories: New info!
Regarding this issue: http://modthesims2.com/showthread.php?t=202762

It appears we may have found a cause, and thus, a solution to why custom accessories are doing this...

The cause appears to be, in most cases, removal of groups. That is, in a mesh that originally has "frame" and "lens" groups, if one only has a "frame" group included in the GMDC and simply leaves out the "lens" group without making a placeholder group, there will be references to the missing "lens" group. While this does not appear to be an error keeping the mesh from working entirely, it does appear to be the primary cause of flashing blue accessories - meshes with missing groups tend to have this issue, meshes with no missing groups tend to not.

Placeholder groups are very easy to make - create a single polygon, shrink it to a single point (snap together), assign 100% to head, fix the group name and comments and hide it inside the head.

In the case of Dr Pixel's alpha necklace this issue is more complicated, as there do not appear to be references in the SHPE and GMND to missing groups. In that old thread he did try to update and remove references to missing parts in the recolour file - and that file was reported as still having the issue - but it's possible there are certain references in the mesh file itself that are still pointing to groups that do not exist.

More investigation is needed, but this does appear to be a major clue.

Huge huge HUGE thanks to JM Pescado for sorting this out - it was his investigation that brought all this to light, and I take credit only for going, "Aha, that makes perfect sense!" The actual discovery is his.

I'll post up info on how to trigger the flashing blue when I have a few more brain cells to spare to the issue - for now I'm going to bed.

my simblr (sometimes nsfw)

“Dude, suckin’ at something is the first step to being sorta good at something.”
Panquecas, panquecas e mais panquecas.
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Banned Asshat
#2 Old 23rd Mar 2008 at 5:45 AM Last edited by bLURR : 23rd Mar 2008 at 6:00 AM.
You get the blue flashing accesoires because there are no alternate files for accesoires like there are for outfits if a mesh is missing or if the recolor is corrupt in any way.

With accesoires it can be caused by many things
missing mesh
missing texture files or improper links to those
missing mat files etc etc etc
You will also get the flashing if you update either the recolor or the mesh itself and overwrite the previous one, doesn't work.(you always had to fix this at the mirror.)


You do not need to make placeholders in the mesh, you need to delete those unneeded meshgroups(subsets) from the propertyset/meshoverlays
Thats the correct way to fix this.

So if you do not need the lens you simply delete the 3 lines in the cpf editor.
*override1shape
*override1subset
*override1resourcekeyidx
And you change the numoverrides back to 1
Fat Obstreperous Jerk
#3 Old 23rd Mar 2008 at 6:32 AM
Yes, but I'm a filthy meshing barbarian and didn't understand any of this, so I was discovered this largely by accident while trying to rip stuff out of the files because they offended me. It was more a discovery produced by "GRAH! PESCADO SMASH!" than any real understanding of meshing. Somehow, I find this easier to understand than "making triangles". I cannot make a single triangle. Deleting stuff, though, I can do well. I like deleting things! SMASH!

Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I cannot accept, and the wisdom to hide the bodies of those I had to kill because they pissed me off.
world renowned whogivesafuckologist
staff: retired moderator
Original Poster
#4 Old 23rd Mar 2008 at 11:55 AM
bLURR - There will still be references to missing mesh parts in the GMND and SHPE. I think this is more the problem than the missing parts in the recolour and adding a little placeholder is definitely the easiest way to deal with this error - especially as that doesn't require updating every single recolour out there for a particular mesh.

my simblr (sometimes nsfw)

“Dude, suckin’ at something is the first step to being sorta good at something.”
Panquecas, panquecas e mais panquecas.
Banned Asshat
#5 Old 23rd Mar 2008 at 12:26 PM Last edited by bLURR : 23rd Mar 2008 at 12:34 PM.
I dont think you will fix it by adding a placeholder as the moment you overwrite the excisting package the game somehow can't reconize the packages anymore.(its good possible its the caches here)
After you have taking it off and on at the mirror again the problem gets solved.

I have made many many accesoires with renamed, deleted and added subsets.
Never changed the shpe or gmnd files, simply because the game doesn't read from them.(objects do, but outfits and accesoires dont!)
accesoires/hairmeshes and outfits will read the subsets from the gmdc no matter wats written down in the shpe and gmnd.

there is just one thing you dont want to do with accesoires, like i said before
''update a excisting package'' as then the problems will start.
Warrior Gryphon
site owner
#6 Old 23rd Mar 2008 at 12:35 PM
bLURR, the game would read from SHPE and GMND files becuase, well, thats how the Scenegraph chain works. It is possible to skip the GMND and just go straight from SHPE to GMDC, but one or both must be in the chain else it wont know what to link or how to find the mesh.

I suspect whats happening is a little more complex, and involves the GMND more closely, but I need to investigate my theory a little more...

Story books are full of fairy tales, of Kings and Queens, and the bluest skies.
Banned Asshat
#7 Old 23rd Mar 2008 at 12:38 PM Last edited by bLURR : 23rd Mar 2008 at 12:48 PM.
Try it and you know it
Name your subsets diffrent in your mesh.
Update the mesh overlay or propertyset with those names.
You will see it will bypass the names that are written down in the shpe or gmnd file.
I agree you will need them to make a working package but as far as i know only to link them to the gmdc
Warrior Gryphon
site owner
#8 Old 23rd Mar 2008 at 12:51 PM
If all three files need to link properly for it to work, how can none of them be used? The logic doesn't actually hold up - if one of them was broken, then the recolour would break, correct? Thus, it must use them (and, indeed, the basic Scenegraph chain does use them). If they, indeed, are not used, then you could set them to complete garbage and it would still work. The fact that this doesn't happen (ie it breaks) indicates that it still uses them at some point.

Story books are full of fairy tales, of Kings and Queens, and the bluest skies.
Banned Asshat
#9 Old 23rd Mar 2008 at 2:44 PM Last edited by bLURR : 23rd Mar 2008 at 2:52 PM.
I didn't say you dont need them, but you do not need to update the subsets in the shpe or gmnd files if you decide to use diffrent ones in your propertyset/meshoverlay and gmdc file.
I wrote this down in response of HP's post were she said you should update those
world renowned whogivesafuckologist
staff: retired moderator
Original Poster
#10 Old 23rd Mar 2008 at 3:21 PM
I never said you should update the SHPE or GMND. In fact, I think that's probably a lot harder solution than simply adding placeholders. Placeholders is by FAR the easiest way to fix this, requires no updating of recolours, and works with a simple change appearance.

I've tested this and it works very very well...

1. Loaded a lot, put an accessory known to flash blue on a sim - in this case, Aikea Guinea's triple rings for males. Saved, returned to neighborhood.
2. Loaded that lot again. The accessory flashes blue.
3. Exited the game. Opened the accessory file, added two placeholder groups - just took it from another mesh that had placeholders (my sparklies mesh) and imported them as .obj files, and fixed the group names... The rings mesh was missing frame and lens and had a present rim group, so I added frame and lens. Committed, saved, reopened the game.
4. Loaded the previous lot with the sim wearing the flashing blue rings. Changed appearance, removed the accessory and put it back. Saved, returned to neighborhood.
5. Loaded that lot again. The accessory does not flash blue.

The same fixed accessory, if put on a sim in the first place (before it ever flashes blue) will not flash blue if you put it on, save, exit to neighborhood, and return.

So it is a -definite- fix which works quite easily - just open the mesh file, add any missing groups using the .obj format, fix the names, commit, save, and change appearance on any sims already using that accessory to reload it and it will not flash blue again.

I'd say a method that -does- work and requires no updating of recolours is by far the best way to fix this.

my simblr (sometimes nsfw)

“Dude, suckin’ at something is the first step to being sorta good at something.”
Panquecas, panquecas e mais panquecas.
Banned Asshat
#11 Old 23rd Mar 2008 at 4:24 PM Last edited by bLURR : 23rd Mar 2008 at 4:40 PM.
It is by far the best way to fix excisting packages, i have to agree
Lets hope people dont make the same mistakes in the future and build correct packages by removing the subsets(meshgroups) in the propertyset or mesh overlay. :D

Every mesh change or update however will result again in a blue flashing accesoire.
I think its caused by 2 things
*outfits have a substitute while accesoires dont so the game will keep looking
*The accesory.cache doesn't gets updated when the game loads while the groups.cache does.
just my 2 cents
world renowned whogivesafuckologist
staff: retired moderator
Original Poster
#12 Old 23rd Mar 2008 at 4:37 PM
I'd say it's also the best way to create new meshes too - and indeed has been the recommended method for a while now. It may end up with a few unused resources in recolour files, but as long as you don't have unneeded textures in your recolour file, a few spare resources that don't take up much space are low-impact and it's -very- easy, even for new meshers, to just use placeholder groups.

my simblr (sometimes nsfw)

“Dude, suckin’ at something is the first step to being sorta good at something.”
Panquecas, panquecas e mais panquecas.
Banned Asshat
#13 Old 23rd Mar 2008 at 4:44 PM
As i explained in a few posts here.
Make all your changes to the propertyset or meshoverlay.
Add or remove groups(or rename them) in those or if you dont want a gender or age remove that particular propertyset or meshoverlay.
Then run your recolor again through bodyshop and clone it again.
All carbage will be gone.(and all files will be updated when you used new subset names.)
Alchemist
#14 Old 24th Mar 2008 at 12:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bLURR
*The accesory.cache doesn't gets updated when the game loads while the groups.cache does.


As best I have determined, the accessory.cache file only changes when the GUID changes. New GUID, new entry. Change GUID, new entry. Update files retaining the previous GUID, stale data from cache is used in place of shiny new file data.

This seems to have mainly become an issue after Pets came out. So as a policy I delete the file when developing anything, particularly anything with an XMOL or XTOL in it.

<* Wes *>

If you like to say what you think, be sure you know which to do first.
Inventor
#15 Old 7th Apr 2008 at 12:23 AM
Yay I finally figured all this out after quite a few Brain Farts and the fact that I know nothing of meshing at all. I used bLURR's Method after stumbling across that section of an accessory accidentally. Of course the item had a Frame, Lens and Rim, So i deleted the lens files and changed the NumOverride to 2 instead of 1. It worked wonders, So thanks so much to bLURR for telling us Now I can use my Vampire fangs and all the necklaces I loved so much. I got rid of all accessories that did that because it really made me frustrated.

Thank you, Thank You, Thank You, bLURR!!!
Scholar
#16 Old 7th Apr 2008 at 7:20 PM
Hurraaaayyyy!!! :D

Please visit WickedNoukFamily Forum for my creations.
Can't take requests, I'm completely swamped with unfinished projects! :O
Test Subject
#17 Old 17th Apr 2008 at 1:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wes_h
As best I have determined, the accessory.cache file only changes when the GUID changes. New GUID, new entry. Change GUID, new entry. Update files retaining the previous GUID, stale data from cache is used in place of shiny new file data.

This seems to have mainly become an issue after Pets came out. So as a policy I delete the file when developing anything, particularly anything with an XMOL or XTOL in it.

<* Wes *>


I'm new to the tech side of TS2, so I have no idea what you just said
But props to you for figuring it out, you smarty pants you! Would you (or anyone) mind explaining that a bit more simply?
Thanks!
Alchemist
#18 Old 17th Apr 2008 at 3:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dolphsara3
Would you (or anyone) mind explaining that a bit more simply?


Like, when you, you know, make things and if you don't delete the accessory.cache file it will sometimes, like, not show the latest version but instead it will, um, show the one in the cache file. It's teh boss.

It seems to happen the most on accessories and items that use texture or mesh overlays (like the dog collar, or Moragues tattoo items).

If you like to say what you think, be sure you know which to do first.
Test Subject
#19 Old 20th Apr 2008 at 4:34 AM
This is certainly a very interesting topic to read about. I'm glad that new breakthroughs are being made, as this is one of the most annoying glitches in the game. Would perhaps a tutorial be written someday for us less tech-savvy simmers? I know that I use Bipsouille's hat and cloak meshes on many of my sims, and I'd love to fix that irksome problem of walking into a room full of sims with bright flashing blue stuff all over them.
world renowned whogivesafuckologist
staff: retired moderator
Original Poster
#20 Old 20th Apr 2008 at 11:56 AM
twisted FATE - It's actually relatively easy to fix but I don't have time to do a tutorial at the moment. In that case I think the best thing would be to contact the creator and point them at this thread and ask them if they can fix it (and fix it in any other meshes they may have done like that) and reupload so everyone can have a fixed version.

my simblr (sometimes nsfw)

“Dude, suckin’ at something is the first step to being sorta good at something.”
Panquecas, panquecas e mais panquecas.
Test Subject
#21 Old 24th Apr 2008 at 11:03 AM
Default help???
umm...im just wonderin if there is any thread for flashing blue objects cos i need help
Banned Asshat
#22 Old 24th Apr 2008 at 12:53 PM
I tried to write down how to fix them yourself but with my english.........
Its located here:http://www.insimenator.net/showthread.php?t=79628
Test Subject
#23 Old 24th Apr 2008 at 1:01 PM
is there any other easier way??like a patch that i can download or sumthin??
world renowned whogivesafuckologist
staff: retired moderator
Original Poster
#24 Old 24th Apr 2008 at 1:36 PM Last edited by HystericalParoxysm : 24th Apr 2008 at 5:02 PM.
bLURR - I still think it's better to fix it in the mesh with a placeholder group - it's pretty easy to do that way and if you have a bunch of recolours you only need to fix it in one place rather than on every recolour. And if you change that stuff in the recolours, the SHPE file in the mesh will still be pointing to subsets that don't exist. Fixing the mesh definitely does fix the flashing blue, while I can't verify that your method works at all - I'm 100% sure adding missing subsets to the GMDC -does- work though as that's been tested, is easy to fix by simply adding in placeholders, and really, is the way we've been telling people to do it all along.

No, miranda. If there were an easier way, we'd tell you. This has to be fixed on every problem item and there's no way to do it easily for everything. Best thing to do is to contact the creators of the items you know are flashing blue, link them here, and ask them to fix it.


Edit: I've created a tutorial with pictures on how to fix flashing blue meshes with the use of placeholder groups: http://www.modthesims2.com/showthread.php?t=283059 ... should be very easy and quick for anyone (creators and downloaders alike) to fix flashing blue meshes with this method. I've also included a placeholder .obj for download so as long as you have a mesh file, SimPE, and my little .obj file, you should be good to go.

my simblr (sometimes nsfw)

“Dude, suckin’ at something is the first step to being sorta good at something.”
Panquecas, panquecas e mais panquecas.
Banned Asshat
#25 Old 24th Apr 2008 at 9:48 PM Last edited by bLURR : 24th Apr 2008 at 10:04 PM.
I know, but alot people cant mesh or have milkshape to make that placeholder wich wasn't available at the time.
You can read in my second post in the link i was planning to do the same as you, make a universe placeholder that others can use.
But you saved me some work, i can add the link now.

Like i said before, the shape or gmnd file doesn't do a thing with the subset names.
Only objects need the info that is written down there.

you can name your subsets A,B or C in de recolor(instead of body/body_alpha/lens or frame) and as long as they are named the same in the gmdc, all will work.
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