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Top Secret Researcher
Original Poster
#1 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 1:04 AM
Default 'Merry Christmas' no longer?
Back Story:
In most states (in the U.S.) the farewell greeting during December was always, "Merry Christmas".
Now that more people from different cultures some are getting offended.
People are offended because, of the meaning behind Christmas. (Jesus and/or God.)

Debate:
"Merry Christmas," "Happy Holidays," or act like it's a normal day.


--------------------------
My Opinion:
I think that the farewell greeting should be, "Merry Christmas" or "Happy Holidays"
"Merry Christmas" because, why change something so special, something that has stayed as a tradition?

So long, my luckless romance
My back is turned on you
I should've known you'd bring me heartache
Almost lovers always do

Top Secret Researcher
DELETED POST
27th Nov 2008 at 1:32 AM
This message has been deleted by Daisie.
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Mad Poster
#2 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 1:33 AM
Personally, I think that telling someone "Merry Christmas" when you're not sure of their religious orientation is highly presumptious and condescending. It suggests that you assume they are Christian, and even if that's not offensive to them, it's unfair and politically incorrect to make that assumption. It doesn't keep me awake at nights and I don't sweat it, but it's the principle of the thing. I think it's just callous and insensitive. I have a Jewish friend who people are constantly wishing a merry Christmas instead of a happy Hannukah, and if that's not rude, then what is? It shows disrespect for her values. Why not just say "Happy Holidays"- it serves the same purpose and provides much less controversy.

Do I dare disturb the universe?
.
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Top Secret Researcher
#3 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 1:38 AM
I'm a minority religion, but I don't care about PCness.... I say thanks if someone tells me Merry Christmas, or Happy Holidays, or Seasons Greetings, or anything along those lines.

As for me? My holdiay greeting of choice is Happy ChrismaHanuKwanzaRamaSaturYuleWali! So far no one has gotten upset at me for leaving out thier religion.

The humor of a story on the internet is in direct inverse proportion to how accurate the reporting is.
Top Secret Researcher
#4 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 1:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabid
Why not just say "Happy Holidays"- it serves the same purpose and provides much less controversy.
Except in my corner of the American south, where "Happy Holidays" is rumored to be a sign of the persecution of Christians and the destruction of the Christian religion.

I agree with you totally, Rabid, but mainly I think that life is too short to get worked up over a well-intentioned holiday greeting, whatever it is. If someone wishes me merry Christmas or happy holidays or happy Kwanzaa or whatever, I smile and return the greeting. Because who really cares?

Alchemist
#5 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 1:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FurryPanda
As for me? My holdiay greeting of choice is Happy ChrismaHanuKwanzaRamaSaturYuleWali! So far no one has gotten upset at me for leaving out thier religion.


I am working hard on memorizing that greeting :-) It'll sure come in handy :-D Personally, I'm not bothered what greeting people use towards me. One of the perks of being a fairly disinterested atheist, I suppose...... :-)
Mad Poster
#6 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 1:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daisie
Except in my corner of the American south, where "Happy Holidays" is rumored to be a sign of the persecution of Christians and the destruction of the Christian religion.

I agree with you totally, Rabid, but mainly I think that life is too short to get worked up over a well-intentioned holiday greeting, whatever it is. If someone wishes me merry Christmas or happy holidays or happy Kwanzaa or whatever, I smile and return the greeting. Because who really cares?


Agreed- it's not something to fret about. When someone wishes me a merry Christmas, I don't unleash on them and insist that they be more politically correct. How do you wish an atheist a happy holiday, anyway ? I think that it's insensitive to make that assumption and nothing can change that opinion of mine, but the world has greater problems to worry about.

Do I dare disturb the universe?
.
| tumblr | My TS3 Photos |
Alchemist
#7 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 1:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabid
Personally, I think that telling someone "Merry Christmas" when you're not sure of their religious orientation is highly presumptious and condescending. It suggests that you assume they are Christian, and even if that's not offensive to them, it's unfair and politically incorrect to make that assumption.


I agree.

People were celebrating at this time of year before "Christ" was even around, if he was, and a lot of things like mistletoe, holy, decorating trees, and traditional foods were practised before Christianity became widespread. It's very likely "Christmas" was superimposed in pre-existing traditions and cultures. When I get jovial this time of year it's got nothing to do with Christ, and like Rabid said, it's pretty presumptuous to assume everyone is celebrating a birthday.
Test Subject
#8 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 1:57 AM
I don't find it "insensitive" when someone gives someone a holiday greeting with good intentions. The same way I don't get offended when someone offers me meat not knowing I'm vegetarian or something as silly as that. People who are way too sensitive about these things really need something to do with their lives as they're obviously looking for crap to occupy their minds with.
Mad Poster
#9 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 1:57 AM
I never thought about it one way or another until this thread, to be honest.

And then there's the infamous spelling "Xmas" which I think many atheists have used but also just those who are too lazy to spell "Christmas." Many Christian extremists despise "Xmas" because they look at it as crossing Christ out of the name.

I speak English primarily. Hablo español. Falo muito português.
Je voudrais practiquer mon français. Ich lerne deutsch. Parlo poco italiano.
Alchemist
#10 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 2:01 AM
Yeah, Frankie. It appears that way. I think it's just a shortening up of the word, but it might have been a way to cross out the Christ part originally. I've always wondered about that.
Mad Poster
#11 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 2:02 AM
Yeah, I guess I should look it up on wiki or something to see what it would say about that spelling. I always warn my international friends online that when they use that spelling, to beware of the possibility of being criticized, lol.

EDIT: Here is what Wiki says about the spelling "Xmas," also spelled "X-mas." It's very interesting, as it is backed up with historical references.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xmas

I speak English primarily. Hablo español. Falo muito português.
Je voudrais practiquer mon français. Ich lerne deutsch. Parlo poco italiano.
Top Secret Researcher
#12 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 2:16 AM
This article is interesting, frankie: http://www.snopes.com/holidays/christmas/xmasabbr.asp. It makes more sense than someone crossing "Christ" out of the word, since I can't think why anyone would bother.

Mad Poster
#13 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 2:27 AM
Wow, that is very interesting indeed. Similar to the wiki article I posted but this one is more to the point. I never even knew that "Xians" existed to mean "Christians."

I speak English primarily. Hablo español. Falo muito português.
Je voudrais practiquer mon français. Ich lerne deutsch. Parlo poco italiano.
#14 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 2:37 AM
it should be "Merry Christmas" just like it always had been. You're wishing someone a great holiday, how can that be offensive? because you're not in that religion? so what. say thanks and walk away.
Top Secret Researcher
#15 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 2:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by omgitsashley
it should be "Merry Christmas" just like it always had been.
But it's never been that way for non-Christians.

Field Researcher
#16 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 2:44 AM
I honestly don't say anything to anybody because I'm not sure of their religious standing plus I'm shy and I hardly talk to people that I haven't known since I was in a diaper. :shrug:
Alchemist
#17 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 2:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by omgitsashley
it should be "Merry Christmas" just like it always had been. You're wishing someone a great holiday, how can that be offensive? because you're not in that religion? so what. say thanks and walk away.


It hasn't "always been" Christmas! The "Christmas" celebrations have been in practice since the Pagans, like I said above.
Scholar
#18 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 3:09 AM
I wish people a "Happy Josh's Day", even though it most likely isn't even the time of year he was actually born.

Y'shua ben Yosef = Joshua, son of Joseph

In the Western world, the birthday of "Jesus Christ" has been celebrated on December 25th since AD 354, replacing an earlier date of January 6th. The Christians had by then appropriated many pagan festivals and traditions of the season, that were practiced in many parts of the Middle East and Europe, as a means of stamping them out.

There were mid-winter festivals in ancient Babylon and Egypt, and Germanic fertility festivals also took place at this time. The birth of the ancient sun-god Attis in Phrygia was celebrated on December 25th, as was the birth of the Persian sun-god, Mithras. The Romans celebrated Saturnalia, a festival dedicated to Saturn, the god of peace and plenty, that ran from the 17th to 24th of December. The earliest English reference to December 25th as Christmas Day did not come until 1043.

The exact month or day or even the year of Josh's birth cannot be exactly ascertained due to a mistaken calculation based on the Roman Calendar by Dionysius Exiguus in AD 525, therefore Happy Holidays is the more apropriate greeting.

Sarcasm is a body's natural defense against stupid.
Top Secret Researcher
Original Poster
#19 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 3:10 AM
I view Christmas as a holiday of happiness and giving.
The lighting of the tree, and decorating the house in Christmas colors was always just a sign of happiness and peace, never anything religous.

"Season's Greetings" is just completely odd.
You aren't going to go to school/work on a nice spring morning and say, "Season's Greetings."

So the meaning I see behind "Merry Christmas" is just like saying, "Have anice day."

So long, my luckless romance
My back is turned on you
I should've known you'd bring me heartache
Almost lovers always do

Mad Poster
#20 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 3:11 AM
No matter what, there will always be ignorant people who have yet to take the time and do research on things such as this. I was ignorant at one point only because I was told that "Xmas" was wrong and I believed it. Now I have opened my mind and realize that that is not true. Many people should do the same.

I speak English primarily. Hablo español. Falo muito português.
Je voudrais practiquer mon français. Ich lerne deutsch. Parlo poco italiano.
#21 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 3:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daisie
Except in my corner of the American south, where "Happy Holidays" is rumored to be a sign of the persecution of Christians and the destruction of the Christian religion.

I totally know what you mean. I live in north Texas in a very conservative town. I've heard quite a few people make remarks about how "happy holidays" is an attack on Christians and/or Christianity. It's ridiculous.

But as far as the whole debate goes, I am pretty indifferent. People should just say whatever they are comfortable saying. However, I have always preferred "seasons greetings." Even when I was five making Christmas cards with crayons and manilla paper. :D
Instructor
#22 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 3:29 AM
Oh my goodness.
I can't even believe we're having this debate.

I don't mean to be rude or offensive, but I like to get my word in(), so here goes.
Yes, I am a Christian, but Merry Christmas OR Happy Holidays OR whatever is just a greeting! I find it.. well, just a little ridiculous that people are so sensitive to this. I will stick to Merry Christmas, or (ooh... wow, do I dare?) Happy Xmas because I want them to have one. If anyone gets upset about this, it's just them getting worked up about a light and good-intentioned greeting.

This is so strange. Haha.
The world has enough problems without making more up.
What happened to Christmas, or December 25th bringing peace and harmony?

And to prove my point, Merry Christmas everyone! ;]

♣. Call Me Janne .♣
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Top Secret Researcher
Original Poster
#23 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 3:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by xJOFLx
Oh my goodness.
I can't even believe we're having this debate.

I don't mean to be rude or offensive, but I like to get my word in(), so here goes.
Yes, I am a Christian, but Merry Christmas OR Happy Holidays OR whatever is just a greeting! I find it.. well, just a little ridiculous that people are so sensitive to this. I will stick to Merry Christmas, or (ooh... wow, do I dare?) Happy Xmas because I want them to have one. If anyone gets upset about this, it's just them getting worked up about a light and good-intentioned greeting.

This is so strange. Haha.
The world has enough problems without making more up.
What happened to Christmas, or December 25th bringing peace and harmony?

And to prove my point, Merry Christmas everyone! ;]


Thank you!
Someone in this very wierd world understands!

So long, my luckless romance
My back is turned on you
I should've known you'd bring me heartache
Almost lovers always do

#24 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 3:39 AM
I work at a grocery store.. And say Merry Christmas. Don't really care if people want to get their panties in a twist over it or read too much into it. I celebrate Christmas, so i really don't care. If someone replied 'happy Hanukkah' or whatever, i'd do that same. Seriously, people are just being freaking nice.
Mad Poster
#25 Old 27th Nov 2008 at 3:43 AM
Eh, Christmas lost its meaning anyway. It's become so commercialized and it will never stop being that way. It's more about "what are you getting me for Christmas" versus "Well, I hope we can have a memorable time with the family and take photos." And many people expect expensive gifts, too.

I speak English primarily. Hablo español. Falo muito português.
Je voudrais practiquer mon français. Ich lerne deutsch. Parlo poco italiano.
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