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Instructor
Original Poster
#1 Old 5th Jan 2012 at 9:42 PM
Default Gay men that marry women, what's your opinion?
I recently read a hearbreaking story on Yahoo Awnsers about a gay guy that sucsessfully came out of the closet at the young age of 14. His parents were not only accepting, but proud of the fact that he had the cojones to even come out. He had a boyfriend in college and his parents and family seemed to like them together. The two men stayed togther as a legal union for about 10 or so years, UNTIL about about 5 months ago when a woman came into his life. Now this guy was full-on homosexual, he fantasized about men, wanted no part of the opposite sex, thought sex with woman was disgusting, until now. He has sex with this girl, found it somewhat enjoyable and now, he plans to marry her one day. His family was incredibly dissapointed that he's now back in the closet, his husband was devastated.

If you want my opinion. Some homosexual men definetly marry women as a way to hide their insecurities. They think something is very wrong with them, they think they have a disease or they're "sinning", or it could just be the drive to be a father. But to me, it's like applying makeup, you can keep putting on more and more, but makeup always washes off and the true face will be revealed. Some people argue that it's impossible to reverse someone's sexuality (AKA Ex-Gay sort of things) While some people think that all gay men need to do is be around women. And to me, none of that religous "pray the gay away" crap works, all it does is fill the pockets of who ever invented it.

So I need your take on this....

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Instructor
#2 Old 5th Jan 2012 at 9:53 PM
If he likes having sex with women he doesn't sound gay. He could be bi.

I don't believe you can 'pray the gay away', but in this case, it doesn't sound like what happened. Sounds like he had an affair, enjoyed it, and decided he might prefer her to his current partner.

I've known several people who have switched orientations. A co-worker who was married, met a guy online, and divorced his wife and married him. They have been together for years now . Another co-worker who was a lesbian met a man and got married.

I personally think sexuality is less rigid than people want it to be.
Mad Poster
#3 Old 5th Jan 2012 at 9:54 PM Last edited by maxon : 6th Jan 2012 at 12:48 PM.
I think there are three things here:

1. It does happen that people fall in love outside marriage though how that is handled by the person concerned does vary. I would guess this guy has hurt his husband very deeply.
2. I can't see, however, how he is 'hiding' from his gayness given that he was out for so long. Insecure in it? Doesn't sound like it.
3. Sexuality is not binary - many people are primarily gay or hetero but there's a lot in between. I, personally, don't find it difficult to believe that a person can be gay for part of their life and be straight for another part. It doesn't mean they deny their sexuality necessarily. It could be that they wish to remain faithful to the partner they are with. <shrug> Sorry, but I think that's a red herring.
The only issue I can really see here is how the man behaved when he broke up his existing relationship and without more information about that, I'm not prepared to comment one way or the other.

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Mad Poster
#4 Old 5th Jan 2012 at 10:00 PM
I honestly don't know what to think. Like you, I tend to believe that homosexuality is innate. On the other hand, I've heard it said that orientation is not so much a case of black or white; that people fall somewhere within a range of sexually orientation towards the same sex or the different one. It may be that he was not a homosexual, but a bisexual. Perhaps, and I really don't know about this, but just perhaps he had been conditioned in one direction only because of early experiences.

" Be kind whenever possible. It is always possible." -Dalai Lama
Mad Poster
#5 Old 5th Jan 2012 at 10:02 PM
Gay, bi, and hetero are all boxes. People do what they want to do.

I'm a graduate of the Harvard business school. I travel quite extensively. I lived through the Black Plague and had a pretty good time during that. I've seen the EXORCIST ABOUT A HUNDRED AND SIXTY-SEVEN TIMES, AND IT KEEPS GETTING FUNNIER EVERY SINGLE TIME I SEE IT.
Mad Poster
#6 Old 5th Jan 2012 at 10:04 PM
14 seems like a very young age to be 100% certain of ones sexuality, especially since the first boyfriend appeared only a few years later. Maybe the guy was confused as he didn't get the chance to try both sexes before.

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Instructor
#7 Old 5th Jan 2012 at 10:23 PM Last edited by SimsLover50 : 5th Jan 2012 at 10:45 PM.
This is from a story on Yahoo Answers? Who wrote it, the gay man, his ex, or his family? What was the question?

A lot of things happen in relationships that are difficult to explain and people have experiences which can change them, or they may be in the closet or denial about their sexuality, or it might not be what they thought or are bisexual.

For example when I was younger in HS there boy who was very interested in me. We went out several times but I wasn't sexually attracted to him but my sister pressured me to date him. She really liked him.

He is now very out gay man. I had no inkling he was gay, and neither did she.
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#8 Old 6th Jan 2012 at 12:43 PM
Quote:
I recently read a hearbreaking story on Yahoo Answers about a guy told folks he liked girls at the young age of 14. His parents were not only accepting, but proud of the fact that he was straight. He had a girlfriend in college and his parents and family seemed to like them together. The couple stayed togther as a legal union for about 10 or so years, UNTIL about about 5 months ago when a man came into his life. Now this guy was full-on heterosexual, he fantasized about women, wanted no part of the same sex, thought sex with men was disgusting, until now. He has sex with this guy, found it somewhat enjoyable and now, he plans to marry him one day. His family was incredibly dissapointed that he's now gay, his wife was devastated.



Doesn't sound too unusual if ya turn it around, does it? Sometimes people discover more about their sexuality as they get older - it doesn't mean they've necessarily changed, just that there are parts about everyone that we may not be in touch with until we've matured enough to see them. An unfortunate situation for everyone involved that it had to come about when he was in a committed relationship that he's now breaking up, but hopefully he'll be happy with whoever he ends up with.

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Scholar
#9 Old 6th Jan 2012 at 2:19 PM
I asked my friends BF when he knew he was gay. As kids you have silly crushes and find someone cute. For him it was always boys, so to say they are unaware really isn't true. However for people who let their kids become transgendered at around that age, that's just ot bloody young.

As for the marriage part, they shouldn't unless they are open about it. I know before gay marriage laws were passed many gay men married just for tax purposes. Shoot for along time my freind (who is BF to above) was going to find a closeted rich guy be the booty call while I be the cover up wife. So long as no one is being fooled however you want your marriage is your business. If you are not being honest with the other person, your not being fair to either you or them.

Lastly to those who think quelling those urges by marrying it rarly works. Know what side of the fense on before you say I do and make sure you love that person your marrying. Divorice lawyers hate people who make their marriages last.

Disclaimer: I am just being a goof ball, please ignore me if offended.
Instructor
#10 Old 6th Jan 2012 at 5:22 PM Last edited by SimsLover50 : 6th Jan 2012 at 5:46 PM.
I think everyone is different though and children do go through stages where they prefer the company of girls to boys or have crushes on people of the same gender. So what may be true 'that they have always known' for one, may not be true for another or may be simply not be clear or had different experiences.

I do think it is wrong to knowingly be gay or in the closet, and marry a heterosexual who believes they are straight or vice versa. It is a betrayal and dishonest. However, I think in the two cases I know about, the person didn't know, or hadn't realized who they were until they met or encountered a person who changed their mind. It wasn't an intentional desire of the partner to hide who they were.

I think of sexuality as a less rigid state than people want us to belief. Both gays and straights can be somewhat unforgiving to those who change or are bisexual or attracted to both or fall in between.
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#11 Old 6th Jan 2012 at 7:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrowningFishy
However for people who let their kids become transgendered at around that age, that's just ot bloody young.
I'm going to assume you meant transvestite/transitioning, since the state of being transgender is rather like the state of being whateversexual, in that no-one can control if or when it occurs.

What I lack in decorum, I make up for with an absence of tact.
Alchemist
#12 Old 6th Jan 2012 at 9:49 PM
What if he's bi, did you even consider that possibility? Maybe he likes both sexes equally. Just sayin'.

Evil doesn't worry about not being good. - The Warden, Dragon Age Origins
Mad Poster
#13 Old 6th Jan 2012 at 10:02 PM
*shrugs* I think that people should be able to be with/marry whomever they want, personally, and for whatever reason, without anyone else outside of the situation judging them, particularly people who don't know the whole story. But of course, that would only happen in an ideal world, which our world is not.

As for sexuality...I frankly find it hard to believe that ANYONE is 100% ANYTHING. IMO, "sexuality" is simply a question of social and cultural conditioning, life experience, and what impulses one chooses to act on or not act on. My wholly unscientific opinion is that human beings are all, innately, bisexual, particularly because we are one of the few species on Earth that has sex more often for pleasure rather than because of a pre-programmed and usually cyclical procreative drive. If one's reason for having sex isn't necessarily reproduction, then it seems to me that there'd be no reason why any kind of programmed preference for one gender or the other would still (or, perhaps, ever) exist in our species. I mean, the drive to reproduce will always be there, I suppose, but a genetically-hard-coded gender preference? No, I don't entirely buy that notion, I'm afraid. And that's obviously not because I'm anti-gay or homophobic.

So I'm taking another stab at documenting a neighborhood. This one stars Benjamin Long. Pathetic attempts at humor can be found here.
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Alchemist
#14 Old 7th Jan 2012 at 2:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by iCad
*shrugs* I think that people should be able to be with/marry whomever they want, personally, and for whatever reason, without anyone else outside of the situation judging them, particularly people who don't know the whole story. But of course, that would only happen in an ideal world, which our world is not.

As for sexuality...I frankly find it hard to believe that ANYONE is 100% ANYTHING. IMO, "sexuality" is simply a question of social and cultural conditioning, life experience, and what impulses one chooses to act on or not act on. My wholly unscientific opinion is that human beings are all, innately, bisexual, particularly because we are one of the few species on Earth that has sex more often for pleasure rather than because of a pre-programmed and usually cyclical procreative drive. If one's reason for having sex isn't necessarily reproduction, then it seems to me that there'd be no reason why any kind of programmed preference for one gender or the other would still (or, perhaps, ever) exist in our species. I mean, the drive to reproduce will always be there, I suppose, but a genetically-hard-coded gender preference? No, I don't entirely buy that notion, I'm afraid. And that's obviously not because I'm anti-gay or homophobic.


this. ^
although i identify as primarily a heterosexual female, ive had serious relationships with women as well (sometimes women interest me, sometimes men interest me, sometimes both or neither interest me...). its more complicated than people think it is....but hey, labeling makes a lot of people feel secure. things are scary if theyre unknown/in the air/constantly changing.

basically, it comes down to what a person finds attractive, and i find it difficult to believe that a person can only find something attractive on one gender/sex and absolutely none other. (you know that "unless youve tried it, you cant know for sure" idea? well, its back, and it has its fangs aimed at your rear.)

not to mention, people are not likely to stay the exact same way all through their lives. it may very well be that they arent confused (which implies an insulting amount of ignorance)--they know themselves through and through. but that self may just be subject to change.

Absolute power corrupts absolutely.
Banned
#15 Old 7th Jan 2012 at 2:32 AM Last edited by 5M0K3 : 7th Jan 2012 at 9:13 PM.
I believe your sexuality CAN change, but it is not so much up to you. You don't choose what foods you like, maybe you hate carrots for years, you try it one day, now you're eating carrots like clockwork. Who didn't love that analogy?
Mad Poster
#16 Old 7th Jan 2012 at 8:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuicidiaParasidia
this. ^
although i identify as primarily a heterosexual female, ive had serious relationships with women as well (sometimes women interest me, sometimes men interest me, sometimes both or neither interest me...). its more complicated than people think it is....but hey, labeling makes a lot of people feel secure. things are scary if theyre unknown/in the air/constantly changing.


For once, SP, you and I agree 100% on something. Mark this day on the calendar.

If I have to label myself, I would stick the "heterosexual" label on me...but in reality I find women much more aesthetically attractive. In other words, I don't want to have sex with them (really, I don't want to have sex with anyone), but I like looking at women more than I like looking at men. Go figure. And I'd marry my housemate if I could, not because I love her in a romantic sense and/or want to have sex with her but because it would A) Make taxes much easier and B) The other legal benefits especially in terms of making decisions for each other would be nice to have, too, since we're both getting older now and medical issues will only become more of a going concern as time goes on. We've lived together for almost 15 years and people who don't know us assume that we are a lesbian couple although we are not, at least in the sense that we don't have sex with each other. In states that have common law, if we were of opposite genders, we would be common law spouses now, but since we're of the same gender...no such luck. :p

But yes, I believe that sexuality is fluid precisely because I don't believe that there's any sort of genetic hard-coding involved. And, like I said, I also believe that the "default state," if you will, is bisexual and that it tends to be sociocultural conditioning and life experience that sends one more toward one end of the continuum or the other. (Kind of like how it is in The Sims, actually. ) In other words, I think "being gay," "being straight," or "being bi" are ALL choices. But, IMO, they're all equally valid choices and should be respected as such. It's just that all that sociocultural conditioning is hard for society in general to overcome. Obviously.

Quote:
not to mention, people are not likely to stay the exact same way all through their lives. it may very well be that they arent confused (which implies an insulting amount of ignorance)--they know themselves through and through. but that self may just be subject to change.


^This. Absolutely.

So I'm taking another stab at documenting a neighborhood. This one stars Benjamin Long. Pathetic attempts at humor can be found here.
I caved and made myself a Simblr. Woe is me. But hey! There's already stuff there that isn't here at MTS. :)
Top Secret Researcher
#17 Old 7th Jan 2012 at 9:18 PM
My take on it is that it's none of my business who marries who, for whatever reasons, or sleeps with except in specific instances where they're breaking laws regarding the protection of animals and children or else there's an interest of public safety or social order. People wandering around spreading their viruses and other critters have to realize there are wider social issues that getting their nuts, and I believe in enforcing consequences and support for children that come as an issue of sexuality. Otherwise, it's not my business and it's not my problem.

More to the point, I don't have any experience with the situation and don't think I could possibly fully comprehend the situation without being in it, therefore it's not a real good idea to chime in directly on it. Ask me about other complicated things I've done in relationship and I can wax anecdotal, but I've never had any discussions within myself about the nature of my sexuality.
Banned
#18 Old 8th Jan 2012 at 6:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistermook
My take on it is that it's none of my business who marries who, for whatever reasons, or sleeps with except in specific instances where they're breaking laws regarding the protection of animals and children or else there's an interest of public safety or social order. People wandering around spreading their viruses and other critters have to realize there are wider social issues that getting their nuts, and I believe in enforcing consequences and support for children that come as an issue of sexuality. Otherwise, it's not my business and it's not my problem.

More to the point, I don't have any experience with the situation and don't think I could possibly fully comprehend the situation without being in it, therefore it's not a real good idea to chime in directly on it. Ask me about other complicated things I've done in relationship and I can wax anecdotal, but I've never had any discussions within myself about the nature of my sexuality.
Exactly. I don't see why we're making a federal case out of this, I mean, WHY is there a story on Yahoo about a man who likes men -- and possibly women -- anyways? Is it really our business what he does in bed? I would be furious beyond belief if there was a story on Yahoo about me sleeping with someone that is not my "preferred" gender. Nobody needs to know about his sex life!
Banned
#19 Old 12th Jan 2012 at 3:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5M0K3
Exactly. I don't see why we're making a federal case out of this, I mean, WHY is there a story on Yahoo about a man who likes men -- and possibly women -- anyways? Is it really our business what he does in bed? I would be furious beyond belief if there was a story on Yahoo about me sleeping with someone that is not my "preferred" gender. Nobody needs to know about his sex life!


Its not always "in bed"


But anyways is it your decision that you want to be gay?
Top Secret Researcher
DELETED POST
12th Jan 2012 at 4:58 AM
This message has been deleted by Mistermook. Reason: Useless responding
Top Secret Researcher
#20 Old 12th Jan 2012 at 5:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dordracio
Its not always "in bed"


But anyways is it your decision that you want to be gay?


I actually define myself as a lesbian. Since the Third Grade I've been attracted to women. And yes, I will admit. I have been with guys as well. I guess to see who I like more. I will not define myself as bi, for the matter of I have been with more women, and I actually find women more attractive than men. And I do not wish to be with a man.

Now, to your question. You do not decide whether you are to be gay or not. For someone of different race, he or she can't decide one day that they want to be another race. Its the same with homosexuals. If we had the option of deciding what we wanted one day then hating the next, then there would be a lot of people trying to "Decide" who they were meant to be. And in honesty...Well, I will keep that to myself.

Now to go back to the topic. He may have been bi, because he didn't have sex with a woman, and when he did, he realized, this feels right as well. If he is happy with both genders, then he is happy. But we also have to look at the spectrum of things.

Is it right for a lesbian to marry a man?

Besides love shouldn't be about sex (Gender) it should be about love and from the heart.

"Queen of the Damned seeks knight in shining piercings for pleasure, pain and purring"--Scary Mary from the Urbz: Sims In The City

"A Famous Explorer once said: 'The extraordinary is in what we do, not who we are.'"--Lara Croft from Tomb Raider 2013
Scholar
#21 Old 12th Jan 2012 at 2:42 PM
He could be bi...
There's nothing wrong with that, but if he did that only for hiding his insecurities, then it's better to show the truth..

Hey there! :)
Top Secret Researcher
#22 Old 12th Jan 2012 at 5:40 PM
Not saying its not a bad thing. He may be had been turn off by the thought of making love to a woman. And there could be several reasons behind that. Do we know them? No. But it is not wrong for him, to have sex with a woman and realize oh my gosh I love this too. This just shows, that he may be have been bi this entire time, and didn't know it, because he never experienced being with a woman. Some people are like this. They like one, then have an experience the other, and realize they like both. And it could be down right to the point of their insecurities.

"Queen of the Damned seeks knight in shining piercings for pleasure, pain and purring"--Scary Mary from the Urbz: Sims In The City

"A Famous Explorer once said: 'The extraordinary is in what we do, not who we are.'"--Lara Croft from Tomb Raider 2013
Alchemist
#23 Old 12th Jan 2012 at 6:06 PM
But nobody mentioned whether he didn't know that he also liked women. Maybe he did the whole time. Maybe he is bi. That is what I'm trying to say. I mean, most probably he is bi. What I don't see, however, is the reason why this is so "heartbreaking" (I'm looking at you, OP). He just didn't want to be with the other guy anymore, so he chose a woman, because he is bisexual. And why would his parents be disappointed? Because he likes both sexes? It makes no sense. Can you provide a link to this story? I want to read it myself.

On a more or less related note, this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevermore Raven
Besides love shouldn't be about sex (Gender) it should be about love and from the heart.

Couldn't have said it better.

Evil doesn't worry about not being good. - The Warden, Dragon Age Origins
Top Secret Researcher
#24 Old 12th Jan 2012 at 8:26 PM
Well, then the question should be turned towards women as well. Is it right for a woman who knows that she is a lesbian, to marry a man, and have children with him, then one day up and leave him for a woman? Is that right, or is that wrong? To me in a its wrong, because to leave a man, after very well KNOWING that she is a lesbian, not to mention have kids with him. Its wrong. If someone knows of their sexuality, and has known it for a long time, then they should stay with what their heart tells them, INSTEAD of listening to the influences around them. If we all did that.

Every single one of us would be straight. Women would be still in the kitchen, men would be working. Bottom line is. If we didn't fight for what WE (as ourselves) believed in. We wouldn't what we have now. The bottom line is this, if he loves the woman let him be happy, HOWEVER, he shouldn't take down everyone around him, because he finally realized something. I understand that he loved men, and needed to be with a man. Though, yes, he did have sex with a woman, and now is out bi-sexual now. I think about this story:

When I was going to College, I met this girl. She claimed to be a lesbian, a hardcore lesbian. But she never been with a woman or a man. Well, weeks later, she found out that she was with a man, and was bi. Because she was offered both genders, and realized that she liked them both. I have always known I was lesbian, but I did date guys, and did things with guys. And proved my point, that I can't get into them, and don't find them attractive the lease bit. But before I made the statement to my family, and my friends that I AM A LESBIAN. I asked myself:

"What if it is just a phase? I mean certainly, I find women so very attractive. But what if I am uncertain. Should I date a guy to find out?"

So, what did I do? I dated three guys. And for some reason, I just couldn't get into it. One time, my boyfriend was massaging my back, and it made me sick...I know, cruel, but it did. I faced the facts and broke up with him, to be with my on and off again girlfriend. Believe me during that huge phase I dated a girl, then broke up with her, to get back with my ex-boyfriend, then dumped him for her. It was like this long...Lone on and off again thing with both. UNTIL one day I realized, that I was into girls. And stuck with my girlfriend, so during that phase I was bi. Until I came to the stunning conclusion. I am a lesbian. Point blank. A lesbian. Which I have to say, I love this line from a movie (But I'm A Cheerleader)

"You can either do the simulation with Brock or run with Megan and become a raging bull dyke." --That was said to Clea DeVull's character...Just love that line.

"Queen of the Damned seeks knight in shining piercings for pleasure, pain and purring"--Scary Mary from the Urbz: Sims In The City

"A Famous Explorer once said: 'The extraordinary is in what we do, not who we are.'"--Lara Croft from Tomb Raider 2013
Mad Poster
#25 Old 12th Jan 2012 at 8:28 PM
It's heart breaking because he broke his lover's heart and after he had seemed so committed by many indications.

" Be kind whenever possible. It is always possible." -Dalai Lama
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