Home | Download | Discussion | Help | Site Map | New Posts | Sign in

Latest Site News

MTS Movie Night #3 - posted on Yesterday at 10:54 PM
Replies: 231 (Who?), Viewed: 41667 times.
Page 2 of 10
Test Subject
#26 Old 28th Jun 2016 at 7:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistermook
I'm sorry, I'm just going to announce that I really just can't take you seriously if you're going to quote Chamberlain at us as something that anyone should implicitly emulate for their politics. Everyone over here's just been laughing their asses off about that all day..


Calls for hawkishness are no joke. Why is peace not a priority? It doesn't matter who said it, it is something for the whole of humanity to strive for.

.If you think it's 'funny' people in the developing world sure as hell don't, it's bourgeoisie first-world arrogance. They are sick and tired of the 'America World Tour' coming to a nation near them, if America thinks it can keep this up while these countries start to strengthen themselves and their alliances, it's soon to run out of easy pickings. The lives of tens of thousands or millions of lives being ruined to enrich a defense company is not something to laugh at.

So If you don't want Chamberlain, why not Eisenhower?

"And now, as in no other age, we seek it [peace] because we have been warned, by the power of modern weapons, that peace may be the only climate possible for human life itself."

"I like to believe that people in the long run are going to do more to promote peace than our governments. Indeed, I think that people want peace so much that one of these days governments had better get out of the way and let them have it."

"In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist."

Or perhaps when Hubert H. Humphrey said "People in places many of us never heard of, whose names we can't pronounce or even spell, are speaking up for themselves. They speak in languages we once classified as exotic but whose mastery is now essential for our diplomats and businessmen. But what they say is very much the same the world over. They want a decent standard of living. They want human dignity and a voice in their own futures. They want their children to grow up strong and healthy and free."

Yes I expect my politicians to want peace, I only want our nation act in self-defense, not in self-enrichment.
Theorist
#27 Old 28th Jun 2016 at 7:39 AM
I apologize for pointing out something that's clearly over your head. Bless your heart, you just go ahead and tell us how Mr. Trump's not a crook!
Banned
#28 Old 28th Jun 2016 at 8:47 AM
This is first time In my entire life where I've had opportunity to have say in government, and I find myself not even wanting to bother with the voting because honestly they are all crooks and which makes it difficult for me to choose candidate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Denver Hoxha
.If you think it's 'funny' people in the developing world sure as hell don't, it's bourgeoisie first-world arrogance. They are sick and tired of the 'America World Tour' coming to a nation near them, if America thinks it can keep this up while these countries start to strengthen themselves and their alliances, it's soon to run out of easy pickings. The lives of tens of thousands or millions of lives being ruined to enrich a defense company is not something to laugh at.

You make me curious. Why you put so much emphasis about us from the "developing world"? Do you really care about us, or are we just mouth piece that you can use to further your interest in Trump?
Theorist
#29 Old 28th Jun 2016 at 11:48 AM
If you can think to ask you already know the answer, right?
Banned
#30 Old 28th Jun 2016 at 12:31 PM
Well if thus were case, the answer would be no, he or she does not care.
Test Subject
#31 Old 28th Jun 2016 at 6:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarVee
This is first time In my entire life where I've had opportunity to have say in government, and I find myself not even wanting to bother with the voting because honestly they are all crooks and which makes it difficult for me to choose candidate.


You make me curious. Why you put so much emphasis about us from the "developing world"? Do you really care about us, or are we just mouth piece that you can use to further your interest in Trump?


Yes I care. I use 'developing' because more polite to say than 'Third World' which implies that things aren't progressing/happening in that part of the world. It's developing, as in it's getting there, it's making progress. People in Africa now have smartphones which allow them to access to mobile banking, roads are being paved, buildings are going up. Because the East Asian Tigers started from little, and now they are developed. When I look at Kigali or Kampala or Luanda and Lagos, I see people building a better future for themselves.

Because when you think of China building roads and buildings in Africa, America is in the background. Trump is the only person really talking about China. If America competed with China, the prices of roads and buildings would go down and Africa would move forward even faster.

I read the news of the world and have many books. I wouldn't do it if I didn't give a shit. I care about these people because they are all people, they have hopes, dreams, families, and they should have futures. America can provide steady leadership, but we can no longer browbeat nations into doing what we want. All we can do now is cultivate good will and friendship rather than hold people in our sphere under the barrel of a gun. I don't believe globalism, because all nations are sovereign and no people should be asked to forfeit their interests to some distant organization.
Test Subject
#32 Old 29th Jun 2016 at 6:57 AM
Firstly, I do believe you care about us and I really appreciate that, but seriously?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Denver Hoxha
People in Africa now have smartphones which allow them to access to mobile banking, roads are being paved, buildings are going up
Banned
#33 Old 29th Jun 2016 at 7:13 AM Last edited by HarVee : 29th Jun 2016 at 7:26 AM.
Roads in north Africa have been paved for years ... millennia even. Worlds first road that could be considered "paved" was Egyptian according to archeologists.

Buildings have always been "going up" in Africa. It's not like we all live in sand dunes or caves, and people have had smartphones for last 8 years or so. We are not that far behind technologically, contrary to what American media makes people believe.
Test Subject
#34 Old 29th Jun 2016 at 8:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarVee
Roads in north Africa have been paved for years ... millennia even. Worlds first road that could be considered "paved" was Egyptian according to archeologists.

Buildings have always been "going up" in Africa. It's not like we all live in sand dunes or caves, and people have had smartphones for last 8 years or so. We are not that far behind technologically, contrary to what American media makes people believe.


I was talking about Sub-Saharan Africa. I didn't to mean to insult you. Mostly, don't forget Libya had the best healthcare system on the continent, and an amazing irrigation project, until Hillary decided to get rid our friend since 2003, Qaddafi.

The phones are coming, and as computers get cheaper and people get wealthier they'll come too. I didn't mean to offend you. I read some articles a couple years back about African entrepreneurs to run their small businesses, so that's the image I had in my head. I found good articles to China building railroads in this case.

See China building another railroad in Africa

Or the one they built

A quick search reveals yet more railways in Ethiopa and Kenya

Shoutout the Egyptian! Looks like you're government looking to China too . I don't blame countries one bit for looking to Moscow and Beijing when we turn on our allies for short-term political goals.

For what I mean on America seeking enemies rather than peace in good faith, RT has a great article: https://www.rt.com/op-edge/347769-n...-russia-threat/. We need rivals, not enemies. During the Eisenhower administration we reached out to the Soviet Union to establish communications, we said we wanted peace, we wanted to prevent war. Trump wants to do what Ike did, Hillary wants more 'enemies' for her patrons in the Military-Industrial-Complex Ike warned us about in 1961.

"A vital element in keeping the peace is our military establishment. Our arms must be mighty, ready for instant action, so that no potential aggressor may be tempted to risk his own destruction...

This conjunction of an immense military establishment and a large arms industry is new in the American experience. The total influence — economic, political, even spiritual — is felt in every city, every statehouse, every office of the federal government. We recognize the imperative need for this development. Yet we must not fail to comprehend its grave implications. Our toil, resources and livelihood are all involved; so is the very structure of our society. In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military–industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists, and will persist. We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals so that security and liberty may prosper together."-Dwight D. Eisenhower.

So there, I believe I've made my case in an articulate and civil manner.
Banned
#35 Old 29th Jun 2016 at 9:03 AM Last edited by HarVee : 29th Jun 2016 at 9:23 AM.
Nothing new there. Anyone that pays attention to Sisi's policies knows Egyptian government trying to negotiate with Asia.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Denver Hoxha
I was talking about Sub-Saharan Africa. I didn't to mean to insult you.

mafish mushkila ya sidi
Theorist
#36 Old 30th Jun 2016 at 3:19 AM
I'm thinking he's just milking the bull in any case at this point. Gaddafi was like the Scarface version of Pol Pot, Denver thinks that because the Italians and French wanted Libyan oil he suddenly stopped being a mass-murdering dictator. Sometimes no matter how much you want to raise a finger and explain in detail all the ways someone's wrong, the smart money's on stepping away and just letting the guy tug. The bull's going to provide the teaching moment eventually anyways, and when people are truly, completely, embarrassingly wrong I've just about decided that no one but the bull's going to do anyways. No one's going to admit that they're wrong in those circumstances, not until they eat their cereal.
Test Subject
#37 Old 30th Jun 2016 at 7:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistermook
I'm thinking he's just milking the bull in any case at this point. Gaddafi was like the Scarface version of Pol Pot, Denver thinks that because the Italians and French wanted Libyan oil he suddenly stopped being a mass-murdering dictator. Sometimes no matter how much you want to raise a finger and explain in detail all the ways someone's wrong, the smart money's on stepping away and just letting the guy tug. The bull's going to provide the teaching moment eventually anyways, and when people are truly, completely, embarrassingly wrong I've just about decided that no one but the bull's going to do anyways. No one's going to admit that they're wrong in those circumstances, not until they eat their cereal.


'Scarface version of Pol Pot'? Really? Pol Pot evacuated the cities forcing everyone to work agriculture and he killed 1/3 of the population. He killed intellectuals, teachers, anyone with an education. He constructed mass-graves and tried to invade Vietnam to reclaim lands that were Khmer in the Middle Ages.

Don't forget. he slaughtered the Cham Muslims. According to Wikipedia

"The Cham community suffered a major blow during the Khmer Rouge rule of Cambodia. The Khmer Rouge targeted ethnic minorities like Chinese, Thai, Lao, Vietnamese and Cham people, with the Chinese suffering the biggest death toll of over 200,000 among ethnic minorities, followed by the Cham, and then the Thai. The Khmer suffered the biggest death toll overall. Around 100,000 of a 250,000 Cham population died in the genocide."

The Cham population hasn't recovered to this day. Qaddafi was a Muslim, and he respected the Berbers and Tuareg, the minorities of Libya, he helped them build wells.

Qaddafi built cities, he achieved the highest Human Development Index in Africa. He brought in skilled technicians from Europe and the Middle East to help build irrigation networks and oil wells. The comparison to Pol Pot is utterly and horrifically naive and invalid.

You clearly lack even the vaguest conceptualization of geopolitical reality or history.
Top Secret Researcher
#38 Old 1st Jul 2016 at 9:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Denver Hoxha
... geopolitical reality or history.

I guess this is as good a time as any to ask about your views of Enver Hoxha, vis-à-vis other major figures you've mentioned.

Ronnie de Noube - Comic and Blog; Sim National Laboratories and our Protein Folding Team.
@)->-----
Test Subject
#39 Old 1st Jul 2016 at 8:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by r_deNoube
I guess this is as good a time as any to ask about your views of Enver Hoxha, vis-à-vis other major figures you've mentioned.


Well I just the name because I like puns, I don't even live in Denver.

Vis-a-vis Hoxha, he was a dictator, he was a hardline Stalinist. While he certainly was tyrannical, it couldn't be classed as 'insane', as Hoxha was a polyglot, he could speak eight languages. While most people think of him as break from the Soviet Union on purely ideological grounds, it isn't that simple. Nikita Khrushchev requested that Albania be an agricultural supplier to the Soviet Union, all while Albania was in the midst of a famine.

While most people see Hoxha as a Maoist, relations had been deteriorating with China since Nixon Went to China (1971), and had Mao lived until 1983 (say like Brezhnev) they would've split. Reasonable to assume consider Sino-Albanian relations continued to deteriorate under hardliner Hua Guofeng until 1978.

While people make fun of him for building bunkers, his sense of intuition was pretty solid. In Eisenhower's first term in office, Albania, due to be isolated by Yugoslavia (due to the Tito-Stalin split, Hoxha was still in the Soviet camp) was considered a target for rollback. Eisenhower never followed through with State Department's plans to invade Albania, but they did exist in the early 1950s.

So Hoxha may have been a brutal dictator, and an idealistic hardliner, but he was anything but stupid.
Theorist
#40 Old 2nd Jul 2016 at 4:16 AM
So basically you really, really like dictators...
Test Subject
#41 Old 2nd Jul 2016 at 7:20 AM
Where do you get me 'really, really, liking dictators' from me pointing out the atrocities of Pol Pot, and calling Enver Hoxha 'tyrannical' .

It is common form of historical study to analyze a character, and then present the facts as a defense attorney would rather than as a prosecutor. It doesn't mean I 'like' who I am defending, It means I try give the devil his due so he gets a lighter 'sentence' so to speak. A renowned scholar on Stalin and Stalinism, Geoffrey Roberts, treats history in this fashion. If I do the same it doesn't make me an 'apologist', it is a form of intellectual analysis.
Theorist
#42 Old 6th Jul 2016 at 6:28 PM
Well at least we know where Denver's getting his love of dictators from.

Donald Trump Praises Saddam Hussein
Banned
#43 Old 6th Jul 2016 at 7:41 PM
By Trump saying "If you want to be a terrorist, go to Iraq" he's sort of indirectly implying that only reason people go to mid-east is to become terrorists.
Theorist
#44 Old 6th Jul 2016 at 8:07 PM
Yeah, or that the reason they're in Iraq isn't because they weren't radicalized folks spilling out of Syria thanks to Assad being another one of those dictators Denver's been praising as some sort ally we should have been fluffing. Or that the other portion weren't radicalized thanks to Saddam Hussein and Maliki.

It's like the whole "African cell phones" thing. I think some people genuinely imagine the Middle East is entirely some sort of unified, backwards place where it's all deserts and... I dunno, genies and kids walking around with bombs strapped to their chests. People are so completely uninformed they've just got fiction to relate to. Even travel shows don't always fix this, because the hosts are entirely out of their element and aren't interacting with people on the right level.
Banned
#45 Old 6th Jul 2016 at 8:33 PM
Travel shows often influenced by big business sponsors though, so show host has to direct their show to appeal to masses by cutting out content that would seem not relatable or too foreign for the viewers of the broadcast and focusing only on glorified image of the destination. It's much like tourism industry. "And if you look to left there is Mausoleum/tomb of famous dead person! But don't look to right or you'll see children begging for money - i.e. the reality!"

I think Trump, being backed by big business and media, suffers from same problem. Exaggerating his arguments to make the situation seem different than the reality.
Theorist
#46 Old 8th Jul 2016 at 2:35 AM
Serious, when does the American society, with a special call towards police, gonna learn we live in 2016 and quit racism and discrimination? For a country pretending to be the best teacher towards other countries and being a so called developed country, it's really bad.

''Afro American + a gun = dangerous'' Serious, such people without brains and ratio are police officers. Are the American police academies literally just like that comedian movie series or are they randomly picked from the streets and just given a badge?

The gorgeous Tina (TS3) and here loving family available for download here.
Instructor
#47 Old 8th Jul 2016 at 9:06 AM
My state has just elected Pauline Hanson to represent us in the senate... so I'm not really in a position to tell anyone what do to (please note I definitely did not vote for her in any way, shape or form).

But I do want to share a couple of observations. The electorates in Queensland with the highest votes for Hanson are areas with lots of unemployment, not much education, and a future that probably looks bleak to many people. But they also have very low levels of immigration - and yet they are the ones voting for a party that wants to stop (Muslim) immigrants from arriving, because they're "stealing our jobs". The same is true in the UK for the Brexit vote - areas with lots of immigrants tended to vote to remain in the EU, and the strong leave votes, to reduce immigration, were from areas that had very few immigrants.

So maybe some of the Americans who are thinking about voting for Trump because he'll keep the Mexicans/ Muslims/ whoever out... should go and actually get to know some of those immigrants. Because you might find that they're not so different after all... and the problem is with the government.
Banned
#48 Old 8th Jul 2016 at 2:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by KittyCarey
So maybe some of the Americans who are thinking about voting for Trump because he'll keep the Mexicans/ Muslims/ whoever out... should go and actually get to know some of those immigrants. Because you might find that they're not so different after all... and the problem is with the government.

Nicely said. This is problem with many societies. They let their fears cloud judgement and label and classify people before they even get chance to know them. Happened numerous times to me as of late being in America. And honestly, what kind of impression does that send to an immigrant when you're not willing to understand their way of life and treat them as equals? It really is no wonder why some turn to crime when they are being devalued by a society that was more-or-less founded by immigrants and whose economy survives on backbone of cheap immigrant labour.
Instructor
#49 Old 12th Jul 2016 at 4:58 AM
Every Trump sentence has words. Sometimes three words. Or two. And they're great sentences. Terrific sentences. That I can tell you. Believe me. They're great. With the best words. Terrific repeated words. Not very big words. Every Trump sentence has words.
Top Secret Researcher
#50 Old 12th Jul 2016 at 5:27 AM
I don't vote, so I couldn't say who I would vote for since I would never vote for any of them. However, I will say that if Trump wins I'll head across to Canada and live there even if I have to be homeless. I don't like Trump, never have, never will. He's the last person I would ever want as our president, so I would seriously consider going to Canada if he wins. I hear Toronto is pretty nice.

Every part of me wants to believe there's a darkness we need to feel for the brightest light to be seen and felt inside.
Page 2 of 10
Back to top