Would a maxis Sims 3 have been better/different?

[Jordan09]

Everyone knows that the game is now made by EA, instead of by maxis. And I was thinking, there has been a fair bit of criticism towards the game and I wondered if the game would have been different had it of been made by Maxis?

Personally, I think that the game would have been more designed to help and support the community. EA have definately seem to have tried to make it difficult for player, either by making it more challenging to create custom content or by the fact that they didn't even release a way of making neighbourhoods in the base game.

I also think that the game would have been different in that it wouldn't have been glitched. Sure the Sims 2 base game wasn't flawless, but it wasn't as bad as Sims 3 seems to have been with problems. EA seem to have released a game that really could have done with several more months work, ironing out any remaining issues.

I also think that the game would have felt more "simmy", more in tone with the first two games. Sure we still have the simlish, simoleons, whacky situations and happenings, but the Sims 3 feels a little distant to the first 2 games. Maybe it is because the game makers wanted to bring the game into a new era, but it feels like it has lost some of its touch, something that I don't reckon would have happened had it been made by Maxis.

Sow what do you think, does the Sims 3 feel somewhat different and do you think that it would have been different, better or even worse had it of been made by Maxis?

[mikrokitty]

Ben Bell just ain't Will Wright. Sniff.

[Jordan09]

Ben Bell just ain't Will Wright. Sniff.

I definately agree with you. In all the interviews I watched about Sims 3 where he he was talking about the game, it seemed like he was trying to hard. It seemed like he was trying to be just as good as Will Wright, which he couldn't be as Will made the Sims from scratch and it is his creation, so he will always be the best at making and directing it.

[catrlgirl]

I agree. It does feel like there is a lack of connecting with the previous two games. It is an entirely new style of gameplay, and it has a completely new action system. It is a different game. I'm actually very dissapointed in it. I don't like this as much as I did the previous game. It has lost the magic for me. I don't know if it would have been better if made by maxis, but I know it would have been different.

[mikrokitty]

I miss the portrait of Will in CAS. Oh, and the Easter Island-style monolith of him that could be placed in the neighborhoods. For that matter, I miss being able to make your own neighborhoods. Yep, I feel like Maxis having some involvement would have done a better job.

[Jordan09]

I also think that Maxis had more of an idea, I would even say more of an actual interest in the community. It seems as if EA is deliberately making the game more challenging for the community to mod, for whatever reason and is also making it more so that the community has to pay for even more things. I mean, there still has been no proper reason from EA why there is no way currently of making new neighbourhoods.

[aeval99]

Even with all the bells and whistles that Sims 2 had, I never thought it had the charm of the original Maxis series. Maxis was basically a small company run by people who really believed in what they were doing. EA is a big conglomerate with people coming and going and different teams working on different things. It really doesn't surprise me that it doesn't have the same personal feel.

That being said, Will Wright has made his feeling on sequels pretty clear. If he hadn't sold the series to EA, I doubt there would have been a Sims 2 or 3.

[mikrokitty]

I also think that Maxis had more of an idea, I would even say more of an actual interest in the community. It seems as if EA is deliberately making the game more challenging for the community to mod, for whatever reason and is also making it more so that the community has to pay for even more things. I mean, there still has been no proper reason from EA why there is no way currently of making new neighbourhoods.

Well, EA is nothing but a dirty money whore... why else delay the game for six months, after all the hype, to drum up additional marketing revenues... and then release it in the state it was released it... bah.

Makes you wonder if Maxis misses us, or if they're glad we're complaining about someone else :rofl:
I dunno... sure, I had complaints about the EPs and stuff packs here and there, but at least those felt... progressive. I can't recall being so dissatisfied with any of those releases as I have been with TS3. And now to find that their first EP is freakin' forty dollars. That still blows my mind.

[Jordan09]

I reckon a Maxis Sims 3, sure wouldn't have been without its faults, but I doubt it would have had so many problems as the EA version does.

And also, many people have said that they would like to see the main neighbourhood opened up, such as opening up rabbit holes, so what do EA do, do the complete opposite and decide the first expansion pack will be a vacation one :wtf:

[haylz320]

II mean, there still has been no proper reason from EA why there is no way currently of making new neighbourhoods.

And also, many people have said that they would like to see the main neighbourhood opened up, such as opening up rabbit holes, so what do EA do, do the complete opposite and decide the first expansion pack will be a vacation one :wtf:

EA want to make money, as simple as that. By releasing a way to make new neighbourhoods, they can't sell new ones at their store later on (just wait for it, it will happen). By releasing crappy EPs first off, they're guaranteeing they'll make more money off it than if it was sold after the good ones - after all, if you've got everything you wanted in your game, why would you pay through the nose for stuff you don't need? Yes, you could argue that it is going to be that way regardless, but a LOT of people will buy this first EP plainly because the game sucks as it is, and just out of curiosity. People will still buy "nightlife" or whatever they wind up calling their TS3 equivalent when it comes out, so they've made money when they may not have otherwise. Yes, Maxis would have made the game better. Hell, I think any company could have done a better job, really. The game is so obviously half-finished. It's been out, what, two or three months? It's already had four patches. That's just ridiculous. I never patched any of my Sims 2 games (if there even were patches released) and never had an issue. Now it seems like you're doomed if you do and doomed if you don't. *sigh* EA suck, that's the long and short of it.

[aeval99]

You never patched your Sims 2 games? There were patches for all of them. As the series went on there were more and more patches and they took longer and longer to come out. Hell, they even had to patch at least one of the stuff packs!

I may be just lucky, but I've had no problems with bugs in Sims 3. Sims 2 however, was a different story. Five years and they still couldn't fix the maid cleaning the fish-tank loop or have a Sim put a coffee cup in the dishwasher rather than walking up three flights of stairs to put it on a coffee table.

EA do suck, but they always have. It's not like it's anything new. ;)

[haylz320]

I never bought the stuff packs. What a joke that was. I'm sure the patches fixed stuff, but I never noticed the issues with TS2 like I did with TS3. I know there were some, but not enough for me to go searching for patches. And since there wasn't a launcher like TS3 that hassles you to patch it, I never really thought about it. Even the issues you mentioned with TS2 aren't anything close to the issues TS3 has (although I'm sure lots of people had bigger issues with 2). Some people can't even run the game despite meeting the specs, the patches have screwed up so many people's games...don't even get me STARTED on how hard they made it to put CC in the game, despite previously encouraging it. Maybe I was just lucky with TS2, I don't really know. All I know is, I could play it fine without patches. Yes, you can still play TS3 without patches, but there are SO MANY BUGS that it's pretty hard to overlook or turn a blind eye to. And yet, people go to patch it and it creates more bugs. You just can't win.

[aeval99]

Didn't you ever get the jump bug? Sims 2 was shipped with a bug that caused the Sims memories to overload and they refused to interact with each other after you played them for a certain number of sim days. Or the ever-spawning tour guides that would implode you game? Pets that sank into the ground if you had the water toy on the same lot?

I didn't buy the stuff packs unless I found them in the bargain bin for less than ten bucks. The only one that was really worth more than that was H&M fashion. Best looking clothes the Sims ever put out.

[haylz320]

nope, can't say I did. Or if I did, I never noticed it. I wondered what people were talking about when they said memories had issues in TS2 and that's why they didn't incorporate it in TS3.

[aeval99]

It's amazing how different machines run the same game. The only bug I've seen in Sims 3 was not being able to turn storymode off when it shipped. I've patched with absolutely no problems and had no problems with CC. It's all run perfectly for me (knocks on wood).

Now the design of storymode is a complete mess, but I think it's working (mostly) the way they planned it to. Of course I've been running awesomemod from the very beginning, so I'm not really sure what storymode does when left to run itself. ;)

Edit: I lost my ability to plant cheese and egg plants at one point. That was really annoying too, but I think Pescado fixed it.

[haylz320]

haha it does basically nothing, which is why I think I'd struggle to play without Indie (and is another reason why I'm not going near the latest patch).

[mdossantos047]

For sure...Maxis would put in that missing piece that everyone's been feeling.

[little bee]

Ben Bell just ain't Will Wright. Sniff.

Here's my tissue and shoulder for you to cry on.
Man, I feel the same way. :cry:


With Maxis I bet there will be more SIMLISH we fell in love with, like...
1. the great whackey sense of humor
(of slapping each other, bumping on each other,annoying each other..LOL)
I missed Maxis humour and twists very much.

2. Loving bonding between sims, like FIRST KISS(roses blooming-fanfare-bodies floating in love), FIRST WOOHOO(bed shaking, music extravaganza), FIRST HUG from the kids to their dads or moms coming home.


I love seemless neighborhood, but I'm not sure I want to trade nostagic sweetness and humor of TS2 for advanced technology+graphics of TS3.
*sigh*


Ps. I read somewhere that at first Ben Bell didn't get it. He wondered why The Sims gained so many fans from 'just sitting playing dollhouses', right?

[magic cookie]

Yes it would have been way different. The original Sims 1 was a consumerism spoof, now that's not the kind of irony that EA could give a game, for obvious reasons ;)

It also lacks the traditional sims humour, stuff with lamas ect... and I miss SImlish music :(

Little bee: yeah, I miss the cutscenes too, they made big moments feel more special, now even wedding's don't feel like anything particular :cry:

[sundaykindoflove]

Little bee: yeah, I miss the cutscenes too, they made big moments feel more special, now even wedding's don't feel like anything particular :cry:

Weddings suck. They took all the romance out of them. There's no slow dance, no tender kiss. It just sucks. :|

IMO, all romance has been taken out of the game completely. There's hardly any romantic interactions available. Plus, they took away a bunch of family interactions, too.

I never look at a moment my sims are having and think "Awww.." I think, "Man, I miss how cute that was in TS2."

Bah.

[Deestar]

Maxis no longer exists Will Wright sold the company to Electronic Arts and it has not existed as a company since 1997. Only the Sims 1 games were made by Maxis after that they became EA. Will Wright has since left EA and gone on to other things so there will probably never be a Will Wright/Maxis Sims game again. Why hypothesize about the might have beens. Maxis was a video gaming company founded by gamers for gamers. Electronic Arts is a business founded by business professionals to make money. The two are not comparable at all. If you choose to play the Sims you are stuck with what Electronic Arts gives you until some kind modder fixes the problems - their goal is not to provide quality games but to make money for their CEO (the programmers and graphic artists are only hired for short term contracts and don't make that much at all) and shareholders. Of course a Maxis Sims 2, or a Maxis Sims 3 would have been better- Will Wright loved the games and he was detail oriented even if paying attention to those details meant he sold the game for less, or offered more in a Expansion Pack or a base game and ended up losing money over it. EA doesn't care about the game- they care about their bottom line.

[crocobaura]

The game does feel empty and half finished and, for me at least, the lightning and graphical issues kills half the joy of the nice things they put in it. I mean, the night sky looks lovely, but there are gradients on it, the lightning looks nice in concept, but its glaring bright. I have dimmed the brightness of my monitor and it's still too bright. I have dimmed the inside lighning and now the glare is less strong, but the rooms are now rather dark and objects look dirty. The sims look lovely in CAS, but in game they look like they are decomposing.
TS1 and TS2 had social interractions in them that made sense. In TS3 it seems that the social interractions come second to gathering and collecting and there is no point in that other than to make money.

[stygia2002]

Will Wright and Maxis had a genuine love for the game, in much the same way that the Sims community creators/modders do. And it showed in the game. Even though Sims 1 isn't as advanced as Sims 2, I still love it and can't bring myself to completely give it up and stop playing it. Sims 2 just totally rocks, 'nuff said. :D Even though Maxis wasn't involved in Sims 2, it's still my favorite of the series.

To begin with, if Maxis would have been involved in making Sims 3, it may have had many of the elements it does now, but it wouldn't have been so unfriendly to CC and community creation in general. The quirky humor would still be there. I agree with sundaykindalove...I miss the romantic interactions and how cute my goofball sims are when they interact when I play Sims 3. I guess that's why I find myself playing Sims 1 and 2 more than Sims 3 (but I do still play it). Maxis would have kept all of the elements that caused us to fall in love with the game to begin with. But, as a few people have pointed out, Maxis washed their hands of The Sims when they sold it to EA. And I'm not even sure Maxis even exists anymore...I keep hearing conflicting rumors and I kind of don't care one way or the other about the drama in that arena. I just want EA to get it right. Of course they're in it for the money...when you own a business, charity doesn't feed your family and pay your bills. I don't fault them for trying to make money, but I'm disappointed that they're trying to squash the creative community that helped make the game what it is.

[Suzicube]

The things that I don't like about this game
1. rabbit holes. Who wants to have a seamless neighborhood just to see sims go into a building and wait for the green line to finish. Sure you can change what they work on, big deal. They could of at least made the grocery store and eating places real lots.

2. Inability to place empty lots and create empty neighborhoods with the cool bells and whistles like adding custom decorations. Also, the inability to zoom in the neighborhood mode. How can you know what it really is going to look like.

3. Lack of party things for Birthdays and Weddings. I used the cake once to age up my toddler and the only thing that happen was a sim took out a new years eve thing and rang it a few times. Oh, and I got to add ballons. Whoo hoo!

4. The lack of hair, clothes, and other content used to bother me but with CC now being created that no longer is an issue. Besides the CC content is far more superior to the Sims content. The store used to bother me until booty came along.

There are a lot of things that I do like but these three things really take away from a lot of the good stuff and made the game boring real fast.

[edejan]

Well, everyone complains about the rabbit holes but they don't bother me so much. It's not too much different from the sims going to work in Sims 2 and just disappearing for 8 hours. I do miss the restaurants and stores but I'm sure they're saving those for EPs and I don't mind that.

I love the seamless neighborhood idea and the beautiful scenery.

BUT, I agree the "feel" of the sims is not there. The social interactions are almost nonexistant and those that are available and not very interactive. It's so difficult for sims to find friends and mates, at least so I think, and the romantic interactions are too difficult and exhausting to get to the point. It taken ten minutes real time to get those damn couples to woohoo and then the walk around the bed, in and out of the room, and stand there awkwardly until they finally give in and woohoo. I guess that's the crux of the problem with the game, the social interactions are not cute, goofy, funny, sweet, they are AWKWARD...so do the designers think we are all geeks and have no social skills so our sims don't either??? I even miss the exxagerated and goofy expressions the Sims 2 made. The Sims 3 are stone faced.

And I agree about the horrid lghting, the zombie like appearance of sims in game (I loved my pretty celebrity sims in TS2) and the problems with CAS - chin shadows, double chins, lack of ability to sculpt certain parts of the face, etc.

So I guess I like the game OK, but I do think it could have been much, much better, if not technically, then at least the feel of the game.

[Misty_2004]

I guess each one of us has our own perspectives and feelings about how the game has evolved.

To me it's like there are not one but TWO Sims 2 games now. The first would be Sims 2A and Sims 3 would be Sims 2B. I fully expected TS3 would take the essence that was TS2 and add to that (of course I wouldn't expect them to include everything in all of the expansion packs, but definitely expand on what is the core of TS2). Instead, it's like they stepped back to the original game and used some aspects that were in TS2 but expanded more from TS1.

In the grand scheme of things, I much prefer the way things have been changed in TS3 compared to how they were in TS2, so in some cases the stepping back and following the new path is really good for me. For example, I love the wish system. The Wants and Fears system of TS2 is way too powerful. If you're not constantly fulfilling wants they slip into aspiration failure. I hated that because it made keeping wants fulfilled way too important. I love the moodlet system in TS3. No longer is the game all about fulfilling wants and wishes. Now EVERYTHING affects a Sim's mood from whether they got a good night's sleep to whether they got to eat a good meal. That system goes a long way in making Sims multi-faceted characters.

I also feel like the trait system is superior, as is the way jobs work. I didn't realize until I started playing TS3 just how sick and tired I was of the personality and career systems (I had been playing these systems on and off for nigh on 8 years!). I was sick to death of "Ooh, my Sim needs a promotion and quick!" which inevitably turned into the grind to skill and make the appropriate number of friends.

I definitely think that if Maxis had developed TS3 it would have been a lot different than it is now. I feel reasonably sure we would have had a game full of ORIGINAL music that isn't random stuff dug up from the public domain. And writing about the music reminds me how much of what is TS3 is being taken to a level of realistic that to my mind isn't good. "Here Comes the Bride" should not be playing at Sim weddings, period. Sims shouldn't be off to take adventures in France, China, and Egypt. Those things are just ridiculous! But it costs a whole lot less to have someone dig up public domain music and imitate real life than it is to spend the time coming up with completely original stuff.

I also feel like EA, in their step toward realism, made some good changes as well. I don't miss green gas clouds and a lot of other "features" that were obviously added to entertain 12s. It seems to me that EA actually realized that a HUGE portion of Sims players are adults and steered some of the features in our direction. Older players like me have been trying for years to get the developers to realize that we not only exist, but have always made a huge contribution the popularity of The Sims franchise.

Definitely, EA utterly failed in delivering a quality product from the outset with TS3 but is its quality really that much lower than TS2? I played TS2 from day one and I have a long memory when it comes to bugs and game problems. My Legacy family nearly came to a screeching halt when I encountered the Jump Bug in the second-gen heiress. Of course this bug was never encountered by people who didn't try playing for generations, or to anyone who got into the game post-patch, but if a person was trying to play through generations, it was a game-stopper very early on. Relatively early into the third generation, the gardener bug appeared and suddenly spawned 90+ gardeners in that neighborhood. Later I unwittingly added a family I had downloaded to that neighborhood. I had no idea when I did it that the problems that were being created when everything from the downloaded family's history had to be added to the game file as well.

In the end, yes, I would imagine that if Maxis had developed TS3 we would have a somewhat different game and definitely one with much more stupidity. I would either have to live with those "features" or go about seeking hundreds of mods to stomp, instead of the couple of dozen I currently have in TS3 which aren't there to stomp behaviors I don't like, but to enhance behaviors I do like.

I am very disappointed, though, in EA's lack of attention to Storymode detail. They totally dropped the ball on that and I haven't decided yet whether I want to give them a big fat "Boot to the Head" award or just send them a one-way ticket on the Fail Boat. Maybe I'll do both. :lol:

[magnemoe]

The things that I don't like about this game
1. rabbit holes. Who wants to have a seamless neighborhood just to see sims go into a building and wait for the green line to finish. Sure you can change what they work on, big deal. They could of at least made the grocery store and eating places real lots.

2. Inability to place empty lots and create empty neighborhoods with the cool bells and whistles like adding custom decorations. Also, the inability to zoom in the neighborhood mode. How can you know what it really is going to look like.

3. Lack of party things for Birthdays and Weddings. I used the cake once to age up my toddler and the only thing that happen was a sim took out a new years eve thing and rang it a few times. Oh, and I got to add ballons. Whoo hoo!

4. The lack of hair, clothes, and other content used to bother me but with CC now being created that no longer is an issue. Besides the CC content is far more superior to the Sims content. The store used to bother me until booty came along.

There are a lot of things that I do like but these three things really take away from a lot of the good stuff and made the game boring real fast.

No problem with rabbit holes for workplaces like offices or the school would be hard or boring to control the sim during the day.
But why shops or even worse, restaurants, why don’t do it like in sims2.
Even the toilet in the park is not useable, the sim can use it automatically, but you can not open the door and direct him inside. Real annoying, one of my sims are homeless and live in the park. One other family live up in the mountain

And yes I noticed the lack of content, In sims2 with nightlife you needed a real large house to have all sorts of items you sims want to use. At the end you could not have all the items.
In sims3 everything fit in a good sized standard house.

On the good side it’s a lot of new play styles, kleptomaniac sims or homeless sims are two nice ones.

And the store / stuff packs are pretty wasted, much better and unique content to be downloaded.

[specialsoup]

I'll agree that there's a certain lack of feeling. I married 2 sims probably 10 sim days ago and they've never woohooed because there's nothing special about it.

Overall though, I think ts3 is a much more fun game. Or maybe I'm just really, really sick of ts2 lol.

[chann]

Interesting thread. I have a lot of comments on this.


I also think that the game would have felt more "simmy", more in tone with the first two games.


I definitely agree. TS3 tries to capture some of the "whimsy" of the first two games, but it feels soulless and sterile in the end. It's clearly the transition from Will Wright's free-form "software toy" to a constrained, story-based and RPG-like game EA devised to appeal to its target demographic. Who are 18-24 year PC gamers, as EA's Russell Arons admitted.

I also think that Maxis had more of an idea, I would even say more of an actual interest in the community.

EA only has an interest in the community as far as it serves their own ends.

It seems as if EA is deliberately making the game more challenging for the community to mod, for whatever reason and is also making it more so that the community has to pay for even more things. I mean, there still has been no proper reason from EA why there is no way currently of making new neighbourhoods.

They HAVEN'T made the game more difficult to mod! The developers have done things the way they have because it makes it easier for them to work on the game. If it happens to impede modding, that's a secondary concern. Don't confuse a signed DLL with a conspiracy. :)

Also, saying stuff like "we're focusing on making the best product etc.", or silence, is standard corporate practice. Bethesda did a similar thing with the Fallout 3 Construction Set, not mentioning a word about it until shortly before they released it, despite wide expectations and speculation because they traditionally release modding tools with their games.

That doesn't give me much hope for EA though.


It also lacks the traditional sims humour, stuff with lamas ect... and I miss SImlish music :(


It feels a bit fraudulent when they put llama jokes in TS3. They're not Maxis. It's like a sitcom character who gets replaced with a new actor and cracks the same jokes and catch-phrases. And yeah, what's with the licensed music being a few ripped mp3s in a folder? They got lazy.

Well, everyone complains about the rabbit holes but they don't bother me so much. It's not too much different from the sims going to work in Sims 2 and just disappearing for 8 hours. I do miss the restaurants and stores but I'm sure they're saving those for EPs and I don't mind that.

True. Who needs to see all that boring stuff? Waste of time to code it in, and it will never be interactive. How many 'go to work simulation games' are out there? None, because they would suck and be depressing to play when you have ACTUAL work to do.

The counterpart is there needs to be interesting non-rabbithole community activities which is why restaurants, bars and recreational stuff are sorely needed. I like the look of rabbit holes compared to regular buildings, too.

My perspective? The Sims 3 is basically a victim of its own success. I have no doubt that if The Sims games didn't sell sold millions of copies its developers would spend much more time catering to the desires of its community (its whole community). Instead, it's a cash-cow juggernaut, so marketing always comes first and good game design comes second. Hence World Adventures is the first EP - adding vacations is relatively little work for them, and EA obviously wants that expansion out for the Christmas period.

I think TS3 would also have been a much more coherent game. Funnily enough, the things that get me are the ways they meddle with the "rules" of the Sims universe. Such as using real-life numerals instead of Simlish, or opportunities/careers that refer to non-existent places and people, or bastardising the game with product placement, or setting the game in freaking real countries when it's supposed to be a fictional setting!!!

It just goes to show where "design by committee" and corporate meddling get you. Unlike developers such as Blizzard or Valve, EA have tenuous connections with their players. Instead of designing a game to appeal to their loyal audience, they will design a game that will sell, and they're pretty good at it. Why bother listening to complaints about story progression and Uncanny Valley-ness when there are 10 more customers that won't?

[dundoniandood]

I have just been on maxis' wikipedia page, and apparently it still exits

Quote from wiki : "It is currently a subsidiary of Electronic Arts (EA)."

It also has a little section about the takeover by EA

Q F W : "Electronic Arts (EA) completed its acquisition of Maxis on July 28, 1997. Compared to other companies acquired by EA, such as Origin Systems and Westwood Studios, the absorption of Maxis has taken a slower pace, and the company has retained some of its original staff, including Will Wright. Products were shipped under the Maxis logo for several years, but in 2004, The Sims 2 bore only the Electronic Arts logo on the box cover (although Sims 2 displays the Maxis logo at game start, and on the reverse side of the box). As of October 18, 2006, and the release of The Sims 2: Pets expansion pack, the Maxis title has been omitted from the game's start. Also, up until The Sims 2: FreeTime, the logo of Maxis was used for a button in the Options panel of the game to display the credits. In FreeTime, the Maxis logo has been replaced by a symbol of the Sims plumbob.

For many years, Maxis was a traditional studio located in Walnut Creek, California (and before that, Orinda, California), but in February 2004 the division was folded into EA's Redwood Shores headquarters.

The present Maxis is based at Will Wright's studio in Emeryville, California."

The underlined section is interesting, it claims Will Wright is still part of Maxis. but he isn't, he moved and founded a new company.

Also I didn't notice the Maxis logo dissapearing after pets, (I need to go back and check) and I don't have freetime so I didn't notice the maxis logo dissapearing from the credits button.

Just an extra bit about how the name Maxis came about...

Q F W: "The company's name was not based on the words "six AM" spelled backwards. Rather, it was derived from a formula suggested by Jeff Braun's father: computer game companies should have two-syllable names and should include an 'x'. This is confirmed in an interview with a Maxis employee on a bonus disc released with The Sims: Makin' Magic. It was only later realized that the name is "six AM" backwards, the time of morning a sim's alarm clock wakes them up."

(I don't know why it contradicts itself at the start)

Any thoughts about anything in this post

[haylz320]

Even the toilet in the park is not useable, the sim can use it automatically, but you can not open the door and direct him inside. Real annoying, one of my sims are homeless and live in the park.

Yes it is. Put the walls down. I thought it wasn't useable either, but it's just that the walls automatically stay up.

The underlined section is interesting, it claims Will Wright is still part of Maxis. but he isn't, he moved and founded a new company.

Also I didn't notice the Maxis logo dissapearing after pets, (I need to go back and check) and I don't have freetime so I didn't notice the maxis logo dissapearing from the credits button.

Wikipedia can't be trusted as a good source of information. I think that bolded statement just proves that.

Yes, the Maxis logo did disappear with the Pets EP. Having not been particularly interested in the whole politics of EA vs Maxis back then, I thought it was a bit strange. Now I think it's a bit strange it took EA so long to remove it :lol:

[stygia2002]

One thing I just don't "get" is why folks are so outraged that EA is using real places. I guess the fact that The Sims is based on an imaginary world is a big part of it and I guess it's a big deal to some folks... I'm not finding fault with anyone for feeling that way, I just don't understand why it matters. It's just not a big deal to me. What's more of an issue for me are things like whether the EP is playable when it's released. Personally though, I'm really excited about this EP...I've always wanted to go to Egypt. :Pint:

[Ranissa]

Huh, I'm gonna be a bit of a dissenting voice here and say "Ugh, no Maxis, please."

Don't get me wrong, I'm not EA's biggest fan as the only game they make that I play is the Sims. I also don't think the Sims 3 is perfect as-is; then again, there isn't a game that I own that I don't mod the crap out of except for Wii Fit. Even when I played WoW, I never quite played within the parameters that Blizzard (and later, Activision-Blizzard) set/expected.

All of that said, again - no Maxis, please. I'm grateful to Will Wright for helping to create the original Sims, as his vision and creativity helped spawn the games that I have honestly spent almost a decade playing (it will be a decade as of Feb next year - crazy, huh?). However, have any of you looked at Spore? Ugh, ugh, ugh and triple quadruple ugh. The thought of the man who helped to create that monstrosity, which I do not mean in a good way, still having his hands on my beloved franchise makes my skin crawl.

I think the genius of the Sims still exists and for that, Will Wright should be thanked. The fact that so many of us play the game and enjoy it and yet not one of us would agree on every aspect as good or bad (look at the people discussing rabbit holes, and that's just in *this* thread) is testament to its longevity and mass appeal.

As a side note, I've been paying a bit more attention to all of the things many people are claiming as "missing" in the Sims 3 and...I have to say, it seems that for every one thing missing, the game has gained two or three things that the community wanted and/or were part of expansion packs. In my book, at least, it's a fair trade, much like the survival of the Sims franchise is worth the loss of Will Wright.

[rmrm]

I honestly don't think it would have been too different. The only difference I can really imagine is that it probably would've been a bit more polished, ie. less glitchy.

[Misty_2004]

As a side note, I've been paying a bit more attention to all of the things many people are claiming as "missing" in the Sims 3 and...I have to say, it seems that for every one thing missing, the game has gained two or three things that the community wanted and/or were part of expansion packs. In my book, at least, it's a fair trade, much like the survival of the Sims franchise is worth the loss of Will Wright.
You're not alone in your sentiment. I was sick and tired of a Sims game where people sat around a table and someone would say, "Hey! We should add THIS to the game!" and others would say, "Oh yeah! That would be so hilarious!" when what they were talking was completely sophomoric behavior that got so stinkin' old after a half-dozen times of seeing it that I could pull out my hair! Then I would have to spend two or three hours looking for a mod to stomp the behavior. It was just a bunch of wasted programming!

That's the kind of thing I have seen make a grand exit from TS3 and the kind of things I am loving being gone! Granted, I don't feel like there is as much actual content as was in TS2 and I think it stinks that on top of paying $50 for a game, EA just expects everyone to fork out more money for more objects that obviously SHOULD HAVE BEEN in the base game since some of them are actually COMPLETER PIECES TO SETS ALREADY IN THE GAME but I am absolutely LOVING the actual gameplay.

I haven't actually been able to play with my Sims in the past couple of weeks but what I have played has been an adventure. I was complaining earlier about the done-to-death employment structure of TS and TS2. Shoot, in TS3 at its very basest, a Sim can earn an excellent living without ever getting a real job. There are enough different things for them to do to earn money while staying home that jobs are optional. If my Sim is having a bit of a hard time earning enough to live on at first selling novels it's not a problem because he can run through town and pick up a few gems to sell. By the time any self-employed Sim starts getting their skills built up they are making good money at what they do. I have one Sim who gardens and fishes with a little help in the garden from a couple of family members who live in the same house. In a single day he usually earns about 5,000 Simoleans. I have Sims that do just about everything there is to do without getting jobs and so far I haven't got tired of them doing that stuff.

but it feels soulless and sterile in the end.
I read this from the very start from different people and that's why when I started playing I decided to go the self-employed route. I wanted to see if I could get attached to my Sims in TS3 on the same level I got attached to them in TS2 and I did. I don't get a feeling of soullessness or sterility when I play. The towns are so pretty and open to my quirky whims that for me it's anything but soulless and sterile. And I became very attached to my Sims.

[EmilyJud]

Didn't you ever get the jump bug? Sims 2 was shipped with a bug that caused the Sims memories to overload and they refused to interact with each other after you played them for a certain number of sim days. Or the ever-spawning tour guides that would implode you game? Pets that sank into the ground if you had the water toy on the same lot?
I never patched any of my sims games and I had TS2 base game,OFB,University,Pets,BV,FT,seasons, and NL. The only bugs I remember having is having my one poor elder have a teddy bear stuck through his stomach(I didn't know about move objects then) and later his baby boy(the social worker took him away). And then having the same elder's son get that reset, delete, cancel box pop-up whenever he tried to marry somebody. I didn't know that their was an awesome sims community and therefore I didn't know about MTS. After freetime came out I discovered sims2community.com(that's what it was called right?) then this site when they merged. When I discovered CC and mods I was like :wtf: what's a hack. I don't want to download anything." Then I downloaded some custom hair or something and I just went."this....is....awesome! Why didn't I find this stuff sooner?" lol

[chann]

One thing I just don't "get" is why folks are so outraged that EA is using real places. I guess the fact that The Sims is based on an imaginary world is a big part of it and I guess it's a big deal to some folks... I'm not finding fault with anyone for feeling that way, I just don't understand why it matters. It's just not a big deal to me.

I personally don't feel "outraged", in the crack-out-the-online-petitions sense. I just think it's dumb to refer to real-life countries in a established fictional setting, and would feel the same way if a historically-accurate simulation included ridiculous fantasy or anachronistic elements for the sake of "fun" and mainstream appeal. (*cough* Total War series ;))

Thankfully this sort of stuff is easily moddable for the people that care about it.

Now if The Sims 3: Disneyland was announced, I would REALLY get riled up. I HATE EA's paid product placement much more than their screwing with the game universe!


I read this from the very start from different people and that's why when I started playing I decided to go the self-employed route. I wanted to see if I could get attached to my Sims in TS3 on the same level I got attached to them in TS2 and I did. I don't get a feeling of soullessness or sterility when I play. The towns are so pretty and open to my quirky whims that for me it's anything but soulless and sterile. And I became very attached to my Sims.

I'm not at that point yet, at least while the custom hood builder is not released. I'm probably going to become one of those people that mods/creates for the game way more than they actually play it. :)

[camglam]

aww man , i loved sims 2 and was expecting ... sort of eveything in the sims 2 up to the last expansion/stuff packs to be in the base sims 3

[Inhuman One]

Some new things are done with the sims3, but no new gameplay is added, and I think the problem lies in that. The sims are not many any more human in their interactions either, children and toddlers cant interact at all even.

Personly I had hoped sims could lay on the couch and watch tv, sit down automaticly when talking with someone, more than two sims being able to have a conversation with many interactions as well, and there just isnt much for your sims to do with their money.

Buying buildings is a nice touch, but it offers no new gameplay. It just gives an extra means of income and the ability to name the building and fire people. Thats all nice, but still doesnt give more to do with the money.

The most expensive objects to buy are cars. Thats fine, but you cant do anything with those cars. All the car interactions of the sims2 should return. Sims should be able to wash the car, install an alarm, woohoo in the car and maybe customize it a bit if they have a high mechanic skill. They could add a spoiler, add stripes or do something else with it that cant be bought but only modified with a high mechanic skill.

As for new gameplay, they could put in some more sports into the game. Martial Arts, Dancing and other such things that sims could learn. They could practice martial arts at home with other sims and spar, and enter a tournament to gain money. That would certainly appeal to the more action oriented gamers.
Sims could also learn to dance the Tango, Cha-Cha, Salsa or some other dances. I wouldnt mind if it was just one song for each dance if that would allow them to dance with the rythm.

Having the neighbourhood so open is definatly a great thing, but EA just has not done much with it.

Personly I would like to see a major league for children. If they practice baseball, soccer or basketball in their childhood, sims could start out a bit better when they take a job in sports when they are adult.

Children playing a sport outside could be done at a field somewhere in town, the interaction being automatic with the rest of the children, the parents could cheer at the side. The athletics ability would determine how well the children are doing, and the combined athletic abilities of the team could determine who wins.

[stygia2002]

I personally don't feel "outraged", in the crack-out-the-online-petitions sense. I just think it's dumb to refer to real-life countries in a established fictional setting, and would feel the same way if a historically-accurate simulation included ridiculous fantasy or anachronistic elements for the sake of "fun" and mainstream appeal. (*cough* Total War series ;))

Thankfully this sort of stuff is easily moddable for the people that care about it.

Now if The Sims 3: Disneyland was announced, I would REALLY get riled up. I HATE EA's paid product placement much more than their screwing with the game universe!

Well, I can understand and absolutely respect that. I guess it's like when I go see a movie of a book I've read and I'm critical of every change they make in the movie (the rare exception being Lord of the Rings...in which I felt Peter Jackson made the story better). I suppose I experience my games in a weird way because details like real world destinations don't seem like such a stretch to me. When I was a kid I played Barbies and I meshed my real world with their imaginary one all of the time...and threw in my best friend's GI Joe world too (my Amazon barbies would go on recon and pilfer his submarine and helicopter for their own use :lol: ...that was back when GI Joe was barbie sized...1970s). The Sims is kind of an extension of the same kind of play...it just takes up less room in the house and I can get away with playing The Sims without inspiring a visit from nice men in white coats. :D But I think I kinda understand how some people might be annoyed at the real world invading their Sims world. They just experience their game differently than I do. ;)

[luckynicole659]

Although EA has made many improvements to the game since the original post here was made, I do still miss Maxis.

I really really do.

[luckynicole659]

I miss the movie scenes the most too though. Like during woohoo, alien abduction, new baby, marriage, first kiss, dropping the kid off at college, graduating college.

The movie scenes made it so much more entertaining, at least I think.

[Robodl95]

TS1 was very easy to program compared to TS3 which is fairly difficult to program. They are working on the same time frame (about 6 months) to do a more time consuming job. Maxis was fun but EA has put way more valuable parts into the series. IIRC Will Wright was opposed to giving the sims wants and fears.

You people have to remember that Will left voluntarily, he wanted to move on to different things. Anyone not motivated about something will not do a good job so stop idealizing what Will would have done...

[kattenijin]

I'm grateful to Will Wright for helping to create the original Sims... However, have any of you looked at Spore? Ugh, ugh, ugh and triple quadruple ugh. The thought of the man who helped to create that monstrosity, which I do not mean in a good way, still having his hands on my beloved franchise makes my skin crawl.

Actually, "that monstrosity" was created by EA basically gutting and "dumbing down" the game Will Wright was trying to create. It is one of the main reasons that Will has been doing his best to break all remaining ties with EA.

[CamiiMania]

I think it would have more personality, like TS1 and most of TS2. The engine might not be any different, but it would have more personality for sure.

[Captain THPS4]

I like to think that if Maxis made TS3 either swimming in oceans, pets, or seasons would have already been in the base game. In reality I know this would most likely not be the case though.

Realistically I do think the sims would have looked a bit different (better) and the sims charm would still exist in large amounts. There would still be plenty of bugs because the very structure of TS3 is much more complicated than the previous games. The personality points system would probably still exist but personally I think that would have been a bad thing since I like traits much better. As one of the producers said in an interview, when you go on a dating site you don't say that you're "8 neat" or "4 outgoing." You would highlight your personality in a way that better explains yourself such as saying that you're neat, friendly, and enjoy the outdoors. Traits make way more sense.

Also, the store probably wouldn't exist either. Maybe stuff packs, but not the store. They might have still offered new objects once in a while, but they would be free and possibly include some of them in EPs anyway like with TS1.

[Rawra]

Look, I just don't understand why some people complain about TS3. I admit it, without customization, it's not that good, but neither was TS2, nor TS1. I personally like TS3 way more than TS2, not to mention TS1. I just don't see why some people say that they don't like Sims 3. I wonder if 2 years from now, when all the EPs and SPs are out, will you still complain? Will you still say how awesome Sims 2 was? It was awesome. But Sims 3 is way better, even now, with the few EPs we have.

To get back on topic, no, I don't think that a Maxis TS3 would have been better. Because EA did many additions to this game, things that Sims 1 didn't have, nor Sims 2. And, people, let's be serious -- there is NO EP of Sims 2 or TS1 which had what Ambitions or WA had. Late Night was, indeed, a mix of Superstar with Nightlife. Not to mention Sims Medieval, which will certainly revolutionize the world of The Sims.

[crocobaura]

Not to mention Sims Medieval, which will certainly revolutionize the world of The Sims.

Sims Medieval is a stand alone game, not an expansion. And there will probably not be much room for customisation either.

[kennyinbmore]

I may be just lucky, but I've had no problems with bugs in Sims 3.

I guess you and I are both the lucky ones as I haven't had any problems either. I always scratch my head when someone says TS3 is glitchy

[suzetter]

I would like to believe it would have been less calculated and boring. Actually, I'm pretty sure Maxis ( or anyone for that matter) could NOT make TS3 Sims any duller or even as dull as EA has managed to do.

[Robodl95]

You guys do realize that The Sims has never been a Maxis series right? EA bought maxis in 1997, TS1 came out in 2000, enough time for EA to oversee most if not all of its production. Making the argument that The Sims has lost all of its charm due to EA is stupid because EA has made all of the sims games (excluding earlier simcity games and such). Maxis HAS slowly dissolved and lost most of its independence it once had but still without EA do you think Maxis would have survived? Probably not (they didn't sell out to EA for nothing...) I doubt Maxis would be able to afford the advertising got from EA by itself.

[CarbonRevenge]

I totally think this game is average and I have little respect for EA as a publisher. They produce a good game every couple years just to get the heat of how bad their business model is as a company. They churn out games like it's a gaming factory. It's mass production in the game industry and it sucks.

EA really has disrespected Will Wright. The creator of many simulation games which have been famous for their unique gameplay. He created The Sims which we are discussing now, Sim City(Another game EA butchered and changed gameplay with), and Roller Coaster Tycoon. All three which have been successful with different variations of things to do. Simcity is to create a city, Sims is to be a person in a city, and RCT is to make a real life theme park on your computer.

At the end of the day, EA still manages to think a new developer will make the series revived or continued. For that matter, EA keeps fixing what isn't broken in an attempt to persuade new players to play the series with no questions asked. They never truly care about the gameplay of the game but the value they can get from owning a popular franchise. But, when EA bought out Westwood because of EAs pressure on the studio and the flop it caused the games have just became exactly what happened to Need For Speed. A money cow.

So, my final conclusion would have to be that EA milks every popular game it has with as little thought to the core audience of the game and what game originally is about. It butchers all games which it grasps like Mitus turned everything he touched to gold. For EA, it'd be everything they touch would turn to crap.

And I also am not buying the EPs for The Sims 3 as I want to stick with the core game because I don't want to spend money on features which should have been included.

[Robodl95]

Another one of those "It should have all been in the BG!" people? The BG was a little lack-luster but do you honestly think that EA has the time and resources to recreate everything TS2 had? Get real.

[Mystical_Elf]

Uh, Will Wright did not create Roller Coaster Tycoon.

[suzetter]

You guys do realize that The Sims has never been a Maxis series right? EA bought maxis in 1997, TS1 came out in 2000, enough time for EA to oversee most if not all of its production. Making the argument that The Sims has lost all of its charm due to EA is stupid because EA has made all of the sims games (excluding earlier simcity games and such). Maxis HAS slowly dissolved and lost most of its independence it once had but still without EA do you think Maxis would have survived? Probably not (they didn't sell out to EA for nothing...) I doubt Maxis would be able to afford the advertising got from EA by itself.

Uh, you do realize you're wrong, right? Electronic Arts purchased Maxis in 1997 as you said but EA purchased the Maxis studio in its entirety (meaning Maxis staff and creative remained in position after the acquisition) and both Sims 1 and Sims 2 were developed by Maxis and while EA owned the studio their primary function in TS1 and Ts2 was as that of publisher and distributor. Some members of the TS1 development team were also on the TS2 development team -- were any of the TS1/TS2 creative team part of TS3's development? I'm not certain but I don't think so. I'm talking creative not marketing personnel. Things started transitioning during the TS2's time in the market place and EA took over development of the The Sims with TS3. Since TS1 and TS2 have a certain charm and fun that for many players is lacking in TS3 it is perfectly logical to make the connection between the change in the game characteristics and the change in the development team. It'd be stupid not to. It would also be stupid to mistake money bags for creative juices.

[MdMaxx]

I can't get behind the camp of I-hate-the-rabbit-holes because a lot of these same people would be complaining if there weren't any rabbit holes. It's bad enough it takes a Sim 30 minutes to pee! Could you imagine the tediousness and utter fail at watching them go grocery shopping? What exactly would be fun about that? And careers? Are you kidding me? Professions are fun only because you actually get to do something with them. I don't care to watch my Sim at his desk job.

[Robodl95]

Staff leaving is different then "it's because of EA!", I'm not saying that staff changing isn't the reason why we're here today but that's not really EA's fault. Sure some might of gotten fired but just as many have left or moved. It has been 10 years after all.

[Mystical_Elf]

Long story short regardless of whether or not the nameless faceless people of maxis that none of you know a single thing about had any input on The Sims 3, it's a great game loaded with tons of content with a ton of effort and money and time put into it, and you're all a bunch of whiny brats for playing it but still being so adamant about complaining about how utterly horrible your life is because the game didn't have a specific tiny group of people working on it.

If the game were exactly the same but had a maxis logo before the title screen you'd probably all be fine and dandy, wouldn't you? I doubt you can even name a single person from maxis besides Will Wright, or a single person who worked with Sims 3 besides Grant.

It's nothing but shallow, selfish whining. I'm sure the people who made the game just LOVE to read about how you don't appreciate the hundreds of hours put into each vacation destination simply because the same few people who worked on the first game aren't the entire staff for the one made 10 years and 30+ iterations later.

Do you know WHY that charm from the first game isn't there? Because this isn't the first game. This is not your first time playing the game and learning about all of it, you're used to it. It's not because different people made it, it's because that was ten freaking years ago on ten freaking years ago's technology and your experiences from 10 years ago.

Pokemon is largely made by the same people as it was when it first came out, but does it still feel the same to pick up a new version and play? No, it doesn't! And it's idiotic to expect it to. It's not humanly possible for a company to somehow make new iterations of a game make you feel like you did when you were 10 and first picked it up for the very first time, and expecting them to is just completely unbelievably selfish and stupid.

[Angstrom]

When it comes to disappointment of TS3, you should remember that we were five years younger when TS2 came out, no matter your age now. Everything felt cooler in 2005 than it does now, because we are getting more picky and demanding, especially when it comes to video games.

When it comes to product placement, the IKEA and H&M packs cost the same as other stuff packs, which seems to be unfair. I can't find any international sales statistics, so I would be happy if you provided it. Anyway, the IKEA pack was the best-selling video game in Sweden for two consecutive weeks.

When it comes to the "real" countries in World Adventures, what would you have liked to see instead? Fictional countries as the Bon Voyage resorts? In my opinions these were stereotypical, bordering to racism.

[crocobaura]

It's not humanly possible for a company to somehow make new iterations of a game make you feel like you did when you were 10 and first picked it up for the very first time, and expecting them to is just completely unbelievably selfish and stupid.

Actually TS3 is a completely different gameplay experience from the first two games. True, old time Sims gamers, might be biased, falling out of interest with the game, but I really wonder how many first time players of Sims find TS3 more intersting than any other game they own and would consider playing it for the next 5 years.

[suzetter]

Long story short regardless of whether or not the nameless faceless people of maxis that none of you know a single thing about had any input on The Sims 3,

Tell me, is ignorance bliss? You assume because you don't know - then no one knows. The development team on games are not a secret -- they get mentioned in all the pre- release press junkets and game expos and listed on gaming sites articles so, yeah, a lot of people actually know who works on what.

it's a great game loaded with tons of content with a ton of effort and money and time put into it,

And you know that for certain, how exaclty? Myself Elf Crystal ball perhaps? Actually, you can think that ll you want just as others can think quite the opposite about how much effort, content, money and time went into TS3.

and you're all a bunch of whiny brats for playing it

Oh and that's a mature comment that really furthers the discussion...


but still being so adamant about complaining about how utterly horrible your life is

Make stuff up why don't you? Preferably something that's a childish exageration of what anyone said.

because the game didn't have a specific tiny group of people working on it.

Well, I don't believe development team size is or every was an issue. It's the quality of talent and caliber of work that is being discussed.
But since you don't know who did what what I'll just point out a few key players:

Maxis
Game Designer - Will Wright (Ts1, Ts2)
Head of Production - Lucty Bradshaw (Ts1, Ts2)
Art Director - Charles London (Ts1, Ts2)

EA
Game Designer (overseer) Rod Humble (Ts3)
Head of production Grant Riodiak or Darren Futa or Sinjin Bain? (Ts3 has had a bunch of producers - can't really tell who if anyone of them was in charge)
Art Director Morgan Godat (Ts3)

the game were exactly the same but had a maxis logo before the title screen you'd probably all be fine and dandy, wouldn't you?

Definately not for just a logo but if the Ts1/Ts2 talented individuals came with it...

I doubt you can even name a single person from maxis besides Will Wright, or a single person who worked with Sims 3 besides Grant.

Please see above

It's nothing but shallow, selfish whining. I'm sure the people who made the game just LOVE to read about how you don't appreciate the hundreds of hours put into each vacation destination simply because the same few people who worked on the first game aren't the entire staff for the one made 10 years and 30+ iterations later.

Oh, :cry: we're so darn mean... :cry: ...poor, poor EA :cry:

Do you know WHY that charm from the first game isn't there? Because this isn't the first game. This is not your first time playing the game and learning about all of it, you're used to it. It's not because different people made it, it's because that was ten freaking years ago on ten freaking years ago's technology and your experiences from 10 years ago.

Some of us have been playing for the entire ten years and have witnessed its devoling into the pablum of Ts3. You probably started simming with TS3 --so you've been playing for what? A year? Six Months?

Pokemon is largely made by the same people as it was when it first came out, but does it still feel the same to pick up a new version and play? No, it doesn't! And it's idiotic to expect it to. It's not humanly possible for a company to somehow make new iterations of a game make you feel like you did when you were 10 and first picked it up for the very first time, and expecting them to is just completely unbelievably selfish and stupid.

Uh, speaking of being ten years old --I just want to point out you are the one referencing Pokemon.

What's idiotic was your over-the-top whiny brat response to what was a perfectly good and civilized discussion. And it is possible for EA to do better than they've done. One of the things that set The Sims apart from other games was the creative interaction it afforded the players (creating your own stories, neighborhoods, buildings, sims, mods, etc) and frankly they are killing that with their lame story progression, directed play, repetetive animation, isolated neighborhoods, etc.

So please, you don't have to agree but save the twaddle for someplace else.

[Mystical_Elf]

No, I've been playing since the first game came out. That's why it's baffling to me that nobody seems to understand that you're never, ever, ever, no matter who makes it, going to get that feeling you got with the first game with another sims game. It's not going to happen. It's not possible, it will never be the same way ever again, this is how everything in life works.

And my evidence for the game taking lots of time to make and being very expensive is based on, you know, how, uh. Games...take a really long time to make and cost a lot of money? I mean, I don't understand how you can possibly try and deny the game took a lot of money, time, and effort.

"I'm don't like that the game wasn't made by maxis and hate one or two features, therefore the game is not an expensive endeavor with hundreds of thousands of combined man-hours put into its development!" is just not a reasonable thought process at all. One of the 3 World Adventures destinations alone is hundreds of hours of work, someone had to sculpt all of it, someone had to make the distant terrain mesh, someone had to place everything, someone had to design everything, design every lot, every sim, then bring them all to life, someone had to build and test and "program" every single tomb, someone had to make the adventure stories, write them, program them, and stick three separate worlds worth of interconnecting adventures together. And you think that just because you've got some issues with the game and it wasn't made by the same people as the first game, it didn't take time and effort and money?

[suzetter]

That's why it's baffling to me...

I'm sure you are often baffled.

"I'm don't like that the game wasn't made by maxis and hate one or two features, therefore the game is not an expensive endeavor with hundreds of thousands of combined man-hours put into its development!" is just not a reasonable thought process at all....

No one said that. Your exaggerations are ridiculous. You make stuff up so you can put down some "Go team EA!" hokum and anyone who doesn't agree with your "defender of the EA realm" declarations is an idiot in your delusional eyes.

You are an idiot.

Fantastic come back, so mature, so original.. and if I'm the idiot (which I am not) why is it that you are the one who is missing the point of this thread?

When the development personnel changed between Ts1/Ts2 and TS3 the unique essence of the game changed as well. Just like restaurants are different when the chef changes. This is what was being discussed here not any "old feeling" bs that you keep making up. People have specific tastes and like certain things and very often in the restauarant world will go eat at the new place their favorite chef works at. This is not possible in the case of Sims. People understand games change as they evolve we just don't believe that the sims series had to lose ALL it's flavor in doing so.

Oh, and BTW, that time money and effort EA spent on TS3 is called "being in business" because that's what they do --they make games. Players don't have to be grateful that EA is going about their business but as consumers of their products we have every right to voice our opinions regarding thier products.

[lazzybum]

no matter who makes it, going to get that feeling you got with the first game with another sims game. It's not going to happen.

So.. if the Sims series lets say all started with EA or a different company, and it was mediocre, would you still play after 10 years?

Lets say if Sim Society for some reason continued to go on 2 more games, would you still play?

I would think whoever makes it matters, they build the game. At least Maxis cared enough to add charm to the game that made the game so popular. Or else half of us wont remember the first game if it was just ehh.

[Ledgo]

I'm sure it would've been less buggy and rushed. EA aren't awful, it's just they rush products or make a mistake somewhere that sucks.

[Angstrom]

To me, EA products don't seem much buggier than other major companies. If games are buggier today than seven years ago, it's probably a consequence from faster Internet connections, as patching now takes less effort.

[Mystical_Elf]

So.. if the Sims series lets say all started with EA or a different company, and it was mediocre, would you still play after 10 years?

Lets say if Sim Society for some reason continued to go on 2 more games, would you still play?

I would think whoever makes it matters, they build the game. At least Maxis cared enough to add charm to the game that made the game so popular. Or else half of us wont remember the first game if it was just ehh.

I don't understand this post at all. I don't understand what about anything you said, has anything to do with anything.

If my first experience with The Sims was mediocre I probably would not continue to play it. How does that have ANYTHING to do with the fact that no sims game, ever, by anyone, is going to give *you*, the people whining that hte game doesn't feel the same as the first one, the same feelings hte first one did when you first played it? Are you trying to make the argument that the real issue is that new players might not have the same experience with the sims 3 as you had with the sims 1? If so, who CARES?!

"Maxis cared to add the charm" is one of the most empty statements I've ever seen. "the charm" is just a buzzword at this point, I'm guessing? There's no actual definition for what it is, it's just "I miss this completely vague idea that The Sims 3 doesn't have"? That vague idea, most likely, is called NOSTALGIA. Surprise! You don't get nostalgia from new things, you get them from memories. I hated The Sims 2 music and now with The Sims 3 i get nostalgic feelings from it. Am I going to complain that I don't get warm fuzzy memories from Sims 3 music the *first* time I hear it? No, because that's completely stupid!

[Celebriton]

I think the biggest problem with The Sims 3 is EA trying to make it DIFFERENT!!!

If you read many articles or interview, it's clearly this is the problem. Remember in some preview, that EA is try to make Late Night different from Nightlife/Hot Date. It also well known that World Adventure is trying to be different from Vacations/Bon Voyage. This is the problem.

While most of the fans hope for improvement, not different. Different can be mean to remove many features while most of us don't want to lose any features or objects in the series. What we want is improvement, more objects and more features. I love the hotel concept in the Vacations/Bon Voyage, I don't want to lose it.

[lazzybum]

Are you trying to make the argument that the real issue is that new players might not have the same experience with the sims 3 as you had with the sims 1? If so, who CARES?!

Umm I said nothing related to that at all...isn't the Sims 1 and the Sims 3 different games? So yes, its not the same experience :wtf: I was just inputting my opinion on how "whoever makes them" matters. Obviously you are too heated and for some reason found my post offensive.


"the charm" is just a buzzword at this point, I'm guessing? There's no actual definition for what it is, it's just "I miss this completely vague idea that The Sims 3 doesn't have"? That vague idea, most likely, is called NOSTALGIA. Surprise! You don't get nostalgia from new things, you get them from memories.

If the beginning of the sims series wasnt good, I wouldn't feel nostalgic for it. I've played numerous games for 15 years, and I only feel nostalgic (or even remember) probably around 20 games total, and its because the game had something special about it that made it good and memorable. Is it wrong for me to believe a game can be charming if it is worth playing?

Ehh I'll leave before rocks get thrown

[mangaroo]

Folks, report flamebait. Responding to personal insults just takes a thread off track. We're here to discuss the game, not the forum members.

[HystericalParoxysm]

Especially when they're pretty obviously a new incarnation of Claeric.

[Lance]

And since moderators themselves started this offtopic, may I ask who the hell that Claeric is? This is not the first time you two mention him :)

[MdMaxx]

Claeric is so weird. Why do you insist on coming back but never change your posting style? It's so obvious. Of course he's also a troll over at MS3B.

[velvetmagras]

Actually TS3 is a completely different gameplay experience from the first two games. True, old time Sims gamers, might be biased, falling out of interest with the game, but I really wonder how many first time players of Sims find TS3 more interesting than any other game they own and would consider playing it for the next 5 years. Me. I fully expect to play TS3 to at least the end of this iteration - approximately 3 - 4 years? When TS1 was released I spent money I really didn't have on a pc good enough to run it. I loved that game.

And I love this game. It's buggy as heck and there are aspects of gameplay that strongly suggest laziness or severe costcutting during design/production and I'm playing it right now. I will play it tomorrow and so on and so on and I'm hoping to get in a some game time whilst I cooking Christmas dinner on Saturday.

[suzetter]

I play Ts3 but not as much as I did TS1 and Ts2. I get bored with TS3 sometimes and stop playing for a few weeks at a time. Often gaming people talk about the genius of Will Wright being how good he is at "thinking out of the box" and how Sims was so successful because it was so different from other video games. I would agree with that as Sims has open ended game play and built in modes for player creativity in-game (building, creating Sims, creating story lines, etc.) Yet I can't help but feel that in TS3 EA is almost trying to shove the Sims back into the standard video game "box" (so to speak) by including so many play directives and initiating so many random goals (WA, opportunities, job goals (catch 25 ghosts, hand out 6 flyers, have 100 good renovation reviews, etc.)

And that these things were put into the game before romantic interactions is very telling. I think it shows that the Sims themselves no longer hold center stage in this game but that the goals and directives are now taking precedent. We had to wait until EP 3 to get the romantic interactions and for the Sims to even acknowledge each other enough to say "goodbye" when separating. There is still not much in terms of family interactions or interactions between friends. Clearly kids and toddlers haven't been given much to do because they don't go on quests or go to work -- which is what EA has focused on. Even in Late Night which was supposed to focus on the recreational there is a lot of goal directed game play.

People always had their own stories going for the Sims they played so why do we have EA story progression which is just a random bombardment of information without structure or purpose? So and so had a baby or moved--well if you were interested enough in those Sims to actually play that household you would know these things. So basically EA SP mostly spews out info on Sims the player isn't even interested in enough to play. This same random info use to turn up in the newspaper to give the illusion of a bigger sim world out there. Is EA SP even necessary? I play with it off but I question why it is even there.

We have separate cities now that are isolated from each other rather than different but joined neighborhoods. Having RH's for work rather than Sims disappearing into cabs to go to work just sucks up real estate and then that community lots from each EP have to be loaded into each city where you want your Sims to have those features is redundant and sucks up more real estate -- so these two factors alone have a negative effect on the player's building aspect of the game as there is limited lot space available. With RH's we also have fewer venue types available to build -- no clothing or grocery stores, no full service restaurants-- I like to see my Sims try things on, or peruse the produce bins and freezer cases when they go shopping. Some people don't care but me? I like it.

I think EA has veered away a little too much from the initial driving concept of the Sims which is what makes it so unique in the world of video games. Right now all the directed play is a bit monotonous and seems like a certain game were you seat the people, give them a menu, bring them their food, hand them the check, repeat -- except in TS3 its look for opportunity, acquire the task, achieve the goal, get reward, repeat.

Personally, I'd like to see TS3 be a tad less goal driven and for game play to return to a more relaxed and open style. Also for there to be more focus on all the Sims relationships (not just romantic) and their emotional side -- (memories, expressions of feelings, reactions to personal events).

[kiwi_tea]

I've been playing The Sims 3 and The Sims 2 for only roughly two years now, and I started playing both at roughly the same time. I've tinkered with The Sims but it's difficult to run on a modern machine and honestly, while it was charming, it wasn't *that* charming. The next two versions are more refined and definitely less madcap, but also much more technologically and visually impressive. I sense they've been tinkered with so that madcap fun is still present, but it isn't as overpowering as in The Sims. The later games in the series seem open to wider a range of players with a wider range of humour. That would just strike me a sensible marketing decision: "It's great to have struck the right chord with some people, but how can we get these people who want more 'realism' more interested in buying the game?"

[coldheartzero]

I just recently reinstalled ts2 and have completely abandoned ts3. I don't mind the instanced world so much because in that one little lot I feel like I can do so much more than I can in ts3 even taking into consideration the disparage in expansion pack additives.

[Lynet]

Often gaming people talk about the genius of Will Wright being how good he is at "thinking out of the box" and how Sims was so successful because it was so different from other video games. I would agree with that as Sims has open ended game play and built in modes for player creativity in-game (building, creating Sims, creating story lines, etc.) Yet I can't help but feel that in TS3 EA is almost trying to shove the Sims back into the standard video game "box" (so to speak) by including so many play directives and initiating so many random goals (WA, opportunities, job goals (catch 25 ghosts, hand out 6 flyers, have 100 good renovation reviews, etc.)
I have played the Sims games since the beginning and as far as I'm concerned you've hit the problem square on the head.

I'm playing Sims 3 now because it's pretty and on my new iMac, (and because Sims 2 is on my old not working very well PC.) The Sims 3 landscapes are gorgeous, but I have little interest in the sims themselves. I abandon them and create new ones all the time. That was not the case with Sims 2. I stayed with certain Sims 2 families for a long time, through several generations, writing stories about them and taking hundreds and hundreds of pictures.

With Sims 3 I feel like I'm being controlled and pushed by the programmers to earn points and rewards, and to buy stuff. Mostly I ignore that because it bores.

I so wish these sims could at least open a car door and get in. Every time they teleport from the sidewalk to the car seat is a reminder that Sims 3 is not up to the standards of Sims 2. *sniff* :cry:

[suzetter]

I also find most of those game goal directives boring but agree TS3 is an attractive game.

[severedsolo]

I sense they've been tinkered with so that madcap fun is still present, but it isn't as overpowering as in The Sims.

That was part of the fun of The Sims (1) It was actually difficult to keep your little guys happy.

Dont get me wrong, I'm a massive fan of TS3, I really am, but sometimes I really miss those days when you saw a fire start and you started going "oh *** oh *** oh *** I haven't bought a fire alarm yet my Sims are going to die!" With TS3 its just "oh look, a fire" *leisurely stroll over, put fire out, emergency over*

Obviously thats just one example... Im sure there were more, but thats the one that stands out in my mind.

[kiwi_tea]

I actually really agree with you there severedsolo. I played The Sims 3 for a month and never had a single Sim die. The first time I played The Sims 2 my Sim's wife died because I was actually working hard to keep the family going. I was like "Whoa, that happens!?" There was more casual, meaningful gameplay with the motives. The Sims 2 was engaging in a different way. In The Sims 3 it's actually difficult not to keep all your Sims happy and alive.

[Pegasys2]

That was part of the fun of The Sims (1) It was actually difficult to keep your little guys happy.

Dont get me wrong, I'm a massive fan of TS3, I really am, but sometimes I really miss those days when you saw a fire start and you started going "oh *** oh *** oh *** I haven't bought a fire alarm yet my Sims are going to die!" With TS3 its just "oh look, a fire" *leisurely stroll over, put fire out, emergency over*

Obviously thats just one example... Im sure there were more, but thats the one that stands out in my mind.
Very very true. I'm still swapping back and forth between TS2 and TS3 but TS2 is open much longer these days. For example:

In TS2 this week, a miniature train track caught on fire. After freaking out and jumping up and down, John Mole died, in the blink of an eye.

In TS3 this week, a sim without an alarm had a fire at the stove. I was amazed at the difference in reaction. My sim casually wandered over, autonomously took out her personal fire extinguisher, calmly put out the fire, and returned to eating her sandwich. There was no jumping up and down, no freaking out, no drop in motives, no negative moodlet, and the stove didn't even get burned.

[suzetter]

I haven't played Ts2 in a long time until recently I played Castaways. That the story was guided felt like TS3 with all it's directives which I didn't like much but I was amazed at how much more animated the TS2 Sims are. They are so lively and react to everything--even just walking along they react to and comment on their surroundings (even inanimate objects) and they are very much more aware of each other and have more interactions with each other and a greater variety of animated reactions to each other. The majority (I'm not saying only) of interaction between TS3 Sims is standing and talking while occassionally tapping their chin. While TS3 sims may be more atttractive its as if they had to sacrifice their personality for their looks. I find the reactionary behavior of TS2 Sims more enjoyable than the non-responsive behavior of TS3 Sims. I also find the animated behavior more realistic --not that Sims have to be realistic since they pick rubies up off the street and pee through their clothes -- that along with forgetting about the children they lose on vacation and spinning around to age or give birth... or vampires requesting a little drinky-poo from friends ...lol

But this isn't about TS2 vs. TS3 -- it's a question of would Maxis have made a better TS3 than EA? I would say yes merely because they would have remained within the original concept of the genre.

Have you noticed how in interviews Will Wright seriously talks about how surprised he is that no one has come along and made another sim type game? He says it often and it doesn't sound to me like bragging. I think he may be hoping that someone does come along and make another Sims game to save the genre. Because while we love those cute sims and he invented them-- more important then the actual game itself is the fact that he created a new genre of video game. With nothing comparable out there and EA making the sims more and more like a typical video games (goals, quests, etc) they may keep the sim title going while killing off the genre itself. There would still be "Sims" but the genre Will Wright created would be a thing of the past. The game from the beginning has been massive fun but the genius of it was in his conceiving of this new type of game. So while the game must evolve it doesn't have to evolve into a different genre of game which is where it seems to be heading.

Though oddly enough, the sims now saying "goodbye" to each other makes me think and hope there could possibly be light at the end of the tunnel. Perhaps. EA is beginning to realize that they have been veering the sims game play too far away from the Sims themselves.

[severedsolo]

You raise a good point about the game being less "Sandbox" and more goal driven suzetter, but in a way, we have sort of brought that upon ourselves.

One of the biggest moans about TS2 (including mine) apart from the non-open neighbourhood, was the fact they put all this cool stuff in for your sims to work towards, but it was difficult to actually get much of it done because you were too busy looking after them and planning their day around pee breaks.

Now to give EA credit, they listened to that, and made it so that the looking after them part took a back seat almost. Unfortunately, what I suspect happened was they then realised "oh crap, now you don't have to spend all day babysitting them, there isn't that much to do" so they got lazy, and put a load of goals in to make it seem like there was alot to do.

I am pleased though that with Late Night (and to a certain extent Ambitions, if you ignore the Professions) the EP's slowly seem to be fleshing out the "sandbox" aspect of the game, rather than the RPG that was World Adventures.

[crocobaura]

....


Somehow, I don't remember them needing that many pee breaks in TS2. For me at least, it was usually the energy bar or the mood bar that went down too fast and didn't allow for enough things to be done. And there were LOTS of things to be done, especially since my sims did all of their socialising on community lots. Hell, they even rented out rooms in community hotels and lived there for a few days. If I took them to a coffee shop, they would drink cofee and interract with the other sims on their own, if I took them to a clothing store, they would browse the clothing racks on their own. What do they do at the coffeeshop in TS3? They stare at the art on the walls or do their homework. I attempted a sort of clothing store with some mirrors and a couple of dressers. What did the sims do? They made funny faces at the mirrors. In TS3 you have this lovely neighbourhood, and there's really not much to do once you leave the house. You have collecting, bars, and that's pretty much it. Everything else is career related or requires you to fulfill some opportunity. You can't even socialise properly because everybody is busy reading, at work, or you need to go through lengthy social interractions every time before certain interractions become available. If you ask me, the TS3 is more about fullfilling the opportunities than it is about the player telling it's own story. The neighbourhood and CAST and the body sliders only make the game look pretty and resemble the previous versions, and actually that's where the resemblance ends.

[suzetter]

I always liked that Sims read a lot because I too am a big reader. However, I agree that in TS3 the reading thing is out of control. Sims do it at the drop of a hat and when it is inappropriate like while hosting or attending a party. (WT?!) I think this is overused in game because it serves as filler to mask that there are fewer responses and interactions for Sims to perform either solo or amongst each other. They have few reactions to each other, few reactions to their surroundings. I miss how animated Ts2 Sims were. I'm not looking to make them achieve, achieve, achieve all-the-time. I enjoy watching them bumbling through their lives in their somewhat clueless but earnest way. I liked it better when my Sims were emotionally responsive to each other and the events of their life.

And I agree that people complained a lot in TS2 about things. But rather than removing from the game so much of their personality, interactions, and relationships, EA would have done better to look at how they could have made those aspects work better in the game rather than removing them.

To me the problem was never taking care of the Sims needs but rather the game clock's use of Sim time in fulfilling those needs.

Many people, myself included, complained about how long the family dinners took in TS2. I think the problem wasn't watching them sit there eating and talking but that the whole thing was about 4 hours of Sims time on the game clock. The TS2 Sim parents got home around 5-6 so my Sim families usually ate between 7-8pm which meant by the time the meal was over it was 11pm at which point most of the Sims were tired and ready for bed. Had the family dinner played out just as it did but register as only 60-90 minutes on the Sim clock (and Sims needs decay) it wouldn't have bothered me and many other players as well because the meal would be over but the Sims were not be as tired or stinky and there would be time to watch TV, play with the kids, help with homework, talk to friends on the phone, pursue a hobby, etc. EA's response to this was to make sims eat so fast they choke. Sort of a wiseass reaction to players complaints.
People complained about how long the family meals took. A logical person would have said "Meals too long? Let's have a look at the time on this action."

Right now in TS3 people complain about how long it takes to get in the elevator and out of the building. I think the animation is paced right and though there are several steps to this action (exit apt, go to elevator, ring bell, wait for elevator, door opens, Sim gets in, elevator changes floor, door opens, Sim gets out, walks across lobby, exits building). I think when the Sim has completed this action and is outside the building only 10 Sim minutes should have passed rather than the better part of an hour in game time (and the Sims needs have been decaying for almost an hour as well).

The problem with filling Sim needs is that small actions take too much Sim time in game. While it seems like Sims may have to pee a lot it can sometimes be attributed to how much time has passed in the game while small and seemingly insignificant actions have occurred and then there’s all the nonsense filler delays (long waits for the elevator, long waits for the bartender, Sim brain farts, etc.). A Sim goes to the bathroom and leaves apt for a club across town by the time the Sim has gotten the elevator, left the building, and either taken a cab or subway or often both (which is somewhat annoying) and walks into the club over 2 hours has passed and then the Sim waits to get the attention of an unoccupied bartender to order a drink and after receiving the drink needs to pee. While it seems that the Sim just left home and got there and got a drink in Sim time the game has clocked almost 4 hours and thereby 4 hours of Sim needs decay. Why the long wait in ordering a drink from a non-busy bartender? Game filler would be my guess. If the travel time could be regulated to register a certain way in Sim time (and Sim needs) in game like 100 meters is 10 Sim minutes or 250 meters is 20 Sim minutes or whatever would make sense in terms of distance and Sim time.

They should try making the things play better in game rather than just deleting those aspects and giving the players less game play. What they did to the TS3 babies, toddlers, kids and teens is atrocious. They reverted them back to their TS1 status –babies are larvae, toddlers exist but are so much less than they were in TS2 (I call them deco), kids and teens are given very little activity and interactions. I like playing the child care aspects of Sims but not everyone does. So rather than deleting many aspects of the Sim family life by reducing babies to larvae, making toddlers, kids, and teens less interactive and animated—EA should have kept the young Sims as active and animated as before if not more so and just added a few pie menu choices for people that don’t like to play the child care aspect of Sims. Things like “auto diaper” or “born talking” or “potty prodigy” etc. Also, let’s face it they didn’t remove these elements because some players weren’t interested – they removed them because these things didn’t apply to the quest oriented game they developed TS3 as --the dollhouse was going to be filled with action figures and action figures don’t come with kids, babies, and siblings (unlike dolls which do).

Unfortunately, when EA reduced younger Sims presence in game and removed so many of those aspects of game play they also took out the parenting and family dynamics of the Sims which for many players was an enjoyable aspect of game play and a popular player created story line. I find it kind of gross that toddlers can’t bathe In TS3. And part of me misses tormenting Sims that tick me off with endless dirty diapers and spoiled milk bottles. One really weird thing is that kids do homework in a flash now but they left help with homeowrk as an option--but the kid finishes the homework by the time the parent has walked over to them. What the heck is that about? Is anyone awake over there?

EA needs to put the Sims family aspects back into the game and work on getting the amount of Sim time used in game for actions to make better sense. 55 minutes for an elevator ride to the lobby? Really EA?

[Klldarkness]

I always liked that Sims read a lot because I too am a big reader. However, I agree that in TS3 the reading thing is out of control. Sims do it at the drop of a hat and when it is inappropriate like while hosting or attending a party. (WT?!) I think this is overused in game because it serves as filler to mask that there are fewer responses and interactions for Sims to perform either solo or amongst each other. They have few reactions to each other, few reactions to their surroundings. I miss how animated Ts2 Sims were. I'm not looking to make them achieve, achieve, achieve all-the-time. I enjoy watching them bumbling through their lives in their somewhat clueless but earnest way. I liked it better when my Sims were emotionally responsive to each other and the events of their life.

And I agree that people complained a lot in TS2 about things. But rather than removing from the game so much of their personality, interactions, and relationships, EA would have done better to look at how they could have made those aspects work better in the game rather than removing them.

To me the problem was never taking care of the Sims needs but rather the game clock's use of Sim time in fulfilling those needs.

Many people, myself included, complained about how long the family dinners took in TS2. I think the problem wasn't watching them sit there eating and talking but that the whole thing was about 4 hours of Sims time on the game clock. The TS2 Sim parents got home around 5-6 so my Sim families usually ate between 7-8pm which meant by the time the meal was over it was 11pm at which point most of the Sims were tired and ready for bed. Had the family dinner played out just as it did but register as only 60-90 minutes on the Sim clock (and Sims needs decay) it wouldn't have bothered me and many other players as well because the meal would be over but the Sims were not be as tired or stinky and there would be time to watch TV, play with the kids, help with homework, talk to friends on the phone, pursue a hobby, etc. EA's response to this was to make sims eat so fast they choke. Sort of a wiseass reaction to players complaints.
People complained about how long the family meals took. A logical person would have said "Meals too long? Let's have a look at the time on this action."

Right now in TS3 people complain about how long it takes to get in the elevator and out of the building. I think the animation is paced right and though there are several steps to this action (exit apt, go to elevator, ring bell, wait for elevator, door opens, Sim gets in, elevator changes floor, door opens, Sim gets out, walks across lobby, exits building). I think when the Sim has completed this action and is outside the building only 10 Sim minutes should have passed rather than the better part of an hour in game time (and the Sims needs have been decaying for almost an hour as well).

The problem with filling Sim needs is that small actions take too much Sim time in game. While it seems like Sims may have to pee a lot it can sometimes be attributed to how much time has passed in the game while small and seemingly insignificant actions have occurred and then there’s all the nonsense filler delays (long waits for the elevator, long waits for the bartender, Sim brain farts, etc.). A Sim goes to the bathroom and leaves apt for a club across town by the time the Sim has gotten the elevator, left the building, and either taken a cab or subway or often both (which is somewhat annoying) and walks into the club over 2 hours has passed and then the Sim waits to get the attention of an unoccupied bartender to order a drink and after receiving the drink needs to pee. While it seems that the Sim just left home and got there and got a drink in Sim time the game has clocked almost 4 hours and thereby 4 hours of Sim needs decay. Why the long wait in ordering a drink from a non-busy bartender? Game filler would be my guess. If the travel time could be regulated to register a certain way in Sim time (and Sim needs) in game like 100 meters is 10 Sim minutes or 250 meters is 20 Sim minutes or whatever would make sense in terms of distance and Sim time.

They should try making the things play better in game rather than just deleting those aspects and giving the players less game play. What they did to the TS3 babies, toddlers, kids and teens is atrocious. They reverted them back to their TS1 status –babies are larvae, toddlers exist but are so much less than they were in TS2 (I call them deco), kids and teens are given very little activity and interactions. I like playing the child care aspects of Sims but not everyone does. So rather than deleting many aspects of the Sim family life by reducing babies to larvae, making toddlers, kids, and teens less interactive and animated—EA should have kept the young Sims as active and animated as before if not more so and just added a few pie menu choices for people that don’t like to play the child care aspect of Sims. Things like “auto diaper” or “born talking” or “potty prodigy” etc. Also, let’s face it they didn’t remove these elements because some players weren’t interested – they removed them because these things didn’t apply to the quest oriented game they developed TS3 as --the dollhouse was going to be filled with action figures and action figures don’t come with kids, babies, and siblings (unlike dolls which do).

Unfortunately, when EA reduced younger Sims presence in game and removed so many of those aspects of game play they also took out the parenting and family dynamics of the Sims which for many players was an enjoyable aspect of game play and a popular player created story line. I find it kind of gross that toddlers can’t bathe In TS3. And part of me misses tormenting Sims that tick me off with endless dirty diapers and spoiled milk bottles. One really weird thing is that kids do homework in a flash now but they left help with homeowrk as an option--but the kid finishes the homework by the time the parent has walked over to them. What the heck is that about? Is anyone awake over there?

EA needs to put the Sims family aspects back into the game and work on getting the amount of Sim time used in game for actions to make better sense. 55 minutes for an elevator ride to the lobby? Really EA?


:beer: Well said!

------------------------------------------------
That's one of the best explanations i have heard so far.

I never had a chance to play the sims 1, but i was a very avid sims 2 player, and i see the difference in it. To be honest, the things that i feel take too long, i cheat at. Need to get to work on the other side of town? Teleport. Don't wanna spend four hours getting to the bar, teleport. It makes it go faster for me.

The game does feel a bit questy to me as well. Someone above said that in one lot on the sims 2, you could do more then the whole world in sims 3. And i agree. Sims 2 base game had alot of content to it, and then university came out, and you had a WHOLE NEW LIFE SECTION! Granted, i found it to be a bit tedious, but there wasn't a questy feel to it in sims 2.

Sims 3, you get calls to do things, like go to the gym for 4 hours, or meet someone blah blah blah. Where are OUR stories at in the sims 3? There isn't one. It's EA's story that we're following. And One sim world isn't big enough for two stories.

How hard is it for you to play your character as an insane scientist bent on inventing a time machine, and traveling to the future, when you keep getting a phone call to go collect pallidiem? No one wants to do that. Granted, turning story progression off does help a bit, but it doesn't help anywhere near enough. Personally, i think there should be a HUGE patch, fixing some things.

1. More Traits. There are 12 good traits, and like 30 bad ones. I'd like to see about 50 more of each.

2. Less questy feel to it, and more sim interactions.

3. More children stuff DAMNIT!

4. Actually get into your car, and stop putting it in your damn pocket!

5. No more filler!

6. Less random sim 20 minute breaks from doing what i told it to do.

7. A huge overhaul to the story progression.

8. Make it a bit easier for the CC people! We only play your games, EA, because we know that if YOU don't have it, then Modthesims.com does!

9. For the love of god, fix the damn lighting issues! It's either too dark, or too bright! Find the middle!

10. NO MORE PUDDING FACE!

More to come.

[sarahsecoy]

Just feels wrong. Only glitch I is that my game keeps crashing after a short time but that could be because I'm playing on a laptop. Sure graphics could be better. I like the seamless neighborhood and being able to 'drive' with the sim. I just wish, hell, who knows.

[Vanito]

- More sim-interactions. Lot's more. Friendly, romantic, kids, funny, neutral, evil, sims is about interaction.
- More personality traits & (inter)actions for existing personality traits.
- More interaction with the environment
- More variety in animations
- Modding made easier. Modding animations & interactions with sims and objects is near impossible.
- Whatever you do and download, sims keep having pudding faces.
- The story progression in the open hood is much underused. The story progression mods show the possibilities of REALLY using the open hood. With settings for minor, medium and major progression.
- And off course, lots of NEW things which were not in sims 2 yet, new animals, new objects, new interactions for old objects etc.

[Sims_Lover]

Yes, Maxis knows what the real Sims is about. It would have been a LOT BETTER.

[laughs_love_peace]

What I miss most is the memories. It really made a big difference when playing with the premades and added a lot to the game. Now you don't have a history for the sims, and that's disappointing.
Another thing that bothers me is the family interactions. I want my kids to be able to play together!

[saeda]

There are really only two things I have issue with:

Game clock and animations just don't make sense, like has been pointed out. It doesn't take an hour to walk from the first floor of your house to the second.

The game needs to have been built being more accepting of CC. Intelligent companies like Bethesda welcome CC and even give their players the tools with which to make it.

Everything else is just details and ultimately can be traced back to these two problems.

[littlewing]

I think it would be way better if Will Wright was in it. I mean, I like The Sims 3, but it hasn't the "sim" thing. It's too real, I don't know how to explain, It doesn't have that magical touch that 1 and 2 had. I've been playing The Sims since I was six (!) man. I miss that weird thing that The Sims 1 (and 2) had, a weird feeling, kinda crazy, the sims theyselves were crazier in a certain way.

[Panther559]

Whatever happened to eating as a family at the tables?

Do the Sims even get sick anymore, where you have to rest to heal? How about the flu?

Remember when you could actually get pimples on your Sims' faces? :lol:

I guess there's no longer any bug infestations for anyone that leaves food out. Interesting!!

So, um, when was there a cell phone attached to me already without having to buy one. What are the actual phones for if we already have cells in our inventory?

Hey, stop flushing the toilet, I'm in the shower!! Remember that from Sims 2 when Seasons came out and you had the options of hot and cold? Now that was funny!! :lol:

Hey, let's go to the restaurant, better yet, let's create our own food mods again!! Oh wait, can't do it. It's all gourmet and ya can't go in anyway.

I personally liked getting married by the wedding arch, just more meaningful, then a honeymoon, the things that really mattered most to me. And what's the Hopeless Romantic trait for again? Oh okay...

Hey, let's make a snowman in the winter, or let's rake leaves in the spring. So much FAMILY values to the previous VS now where it's almost like just everyone is for themselves, forget family!!

Hey, put your coats on because it's cold outside. Be careful of the lightening and watch out for those puddles!!

Do children even exist in this world? I guess they don't need to get dressed. Please, we make our children look better than us as parents sometimes. Come on!!

Teenagers sound like adults now? Really, oh better yet, they even look like adults too. I guess they should have just went from child to adult and forget teenager.

How about the REAL apartment life, where you can actually have multiple units and not just one level, and you can actually VISIT your neighbors in their apartments, IN THE SAME BUILDING. High rise is okay for downtown, but not for suburban communities.

Hey, I actually went to college and did almost everything that college would have to offer. Oh, and I graduated from college and got a degree, which triggered an increase in money for the same job if I didn't have one (degree), and got a chance to hang out on campus to throw a graduation party before going back home. Realism...WOW!!

Bowling, roller/ice skating? Shopping for clothes/furniture/etc., volleyball, snowball fights, snow sledding, etc.? Things to do on a REAL vacation including staying in a lodge/hotel for the duration of the days WITH a registration desk? That was super fun!!

How about simply being able to make the game what you want it with the EASE of modding and creating/meshing period? Creating our own animations?

Yeah, there's so many things that I'm sure we can go on, and on, and on, and on, and on, and on......about, but the bottom line is, it will NEVER happen.

That's the disappointing factor about this whole thing, answering the question of this thread in my opinion, I believe it would have been more on the lines of a consistency of flow from one series to the next, where you actually felt the connection of the creator to the game. It was displayed in each release, be base game, EP, or SP.

Not to say better or worst, as that would be in the opinion of the individual, but for me, I would say that I probably would have enjoyed it more if it were on those lines of creativity since it would have been a MAXIS feel.


Happy Sim-ming 1's, 2's and 3's!!

[blunderboy]

I've never played TS2, so I can't compare my TS3 experience to it. I went from the original straight to TS3 after a four-year hiatus.

I agree that TS3 is extremely 'questy', especially in comparison to the original. The opportunities are fun, but sometimes they're just plain ridiculous. No, I don't want my Sim to work until she's fatigued (for Simoleons or celebrity points or whatever) when she's working on tutoring her kid or building a time machine or doing something else. The game's supposed to be freeform, and I don't think that major aspects of gameplay should be dependent on objectives. For instance, World Adventures' visa system is ridiculous, and I always use a cheat to increase the visa level to 3 so that my families can hang out in foreign countries without having to excavate tombs if they just want to go and sample the nectar and meet locals. I'm attracted to The Sims series because it's *freeform*; if I wanted to play a standard game with failure states and clearly defined objectives, I would!

I cannot stand how limited the social interactions with children and toddlers are. Real-life toddlers are a lot more talkative and, well, mobile than the game ones are; if their needs are satisfied, they just sit there and gurgle, and can't initiate social interactions at all. Children don't have access to 'special' socials associated with their traits, even though they have the traits to do so. I don't have a problem with the 'tones' that social interactions take, because I think that it's a bit more realistic to have to build up momentum before being able to do things like propose marriage or WooHoo with someone. I do, however, have problems with EA's limits on them. I'm not seeing the problem with the teens, because they have every interaction that the adults have with the exception of WooHoo and marriage without mods.

They should also make it so that you can choose different families whenever you load the game, as opposed to having the saved game associated with a particular family and having to go to Edit Town to change the active family. (I generally get around this by starting new games, but it's annoying to have to do that, especially when I want different families to be able to form relationships with one another.)

I still find TS3 pretty enjoyable, though, and can play it for hours.

I can't play TS3 without mods, but then again, I didn't play the original game unmodified, either.

[hotaru801]

There's no love at home or anywhere inside of TS3. Families feel cold and there is an obvious gap between the age groups because a lack of interactions. Weddings are so... boring... Giving birth is so... Lame... Raising a toddler is... urrgh... And I got the expansion packs, as someone earlier stated, out of curiosity...Twas a waste. They just got worse and worse. And you can see that the community is kind of blah right now when it comes to TS3, look at the new items and mods. Since LN they've slowed down. But of course TS2 is still chugging along... I'm wondering if I should switch back for good. EA lacks the knowledge of the intimacy sim players enjoy... Maxis did a fine thing. EA maybe ruined it.

[andreasaspenberg]

i believe the sims 3 to be the best. i play with aging completely off. that enables me to combine the freedom of the sims 1 with the features of the sims 3. it was good that they removed the room and comfort gauges. the addition of washable clothes made it even easier.

[ProfPlumbob]

They could start by bringing back Lucy Bradshaw.

[AngelicScot]

Having read through this entire thread, I have to say I agree almost whole heartedly with Suzetter. I'm not the toddler lover a lot of other people are. I like playing families. I'd get attached to the little sim I'd create. I'd find just the right NPC for him/her and they'd marry, run off to Twikki Island for a three to four day honeymoon, then they'd come home and start being a family. And start HAVING a family.Yet in the Sims 3, I find the way you have to build romantic socials up EVERY time frustrating and annoying. What?! They hate each other after just 10 minutes? They don't act or react like a FAMILY. I think that what people forget is that Will Wright created the sims as an architectural exercise.This was HIS claim. The better the house was designed, the more efficient the sims were at taking care of their needs. With us directing them, of course! Yes, there was more 'babysitting' in the sims 1 and 2, but you got a lot more entertainment for the trouble! The Sims 3 team seems to have just sucked the soul out of the game. I don't get attached to my sims 3 sims at all. Losing my games over and over and over again due to glitches and bugs, doesn't bother me. Why would it? It's not like the sims really have any personality. My desktop which has my Sims 3 installed on it has been down for almost a month. My husband bought me a laptop. I installed Sims LifeStories and have been perfectly content to go through Riley's story and play on Free Play. I don't miss a THING about Sims 3. I DO miss my desktop! LOL We will be fixing it ASAP. We're still diagnosing. Think it might be a motherboard issue. And I have to say, I spent a fair amount of time reinstalling all my Sims 2, when the system is back up, I'll probably just go back to that.

[TheLB]

I'm going to have someone jump down my throat for this, but...

I'm perfectly content with TS3. I just downloaded some cc and mods today which added and/or fixed things to the game which without, I thought were going to be dealbreakers. Is it a perfect game? No. Do I disagree with a lot of EA's decisions? Hell yes. But the honest truth is EA isn't really concerned. They have a billion other franchises out there and I can guarantee you TS3 isn't even their highest selling one. If they're going to coddle a franchise, The Sims is not going to be that franchise. You have to take that into account.

Also, I think that a lot of people have been spoiled. I mean, just look at how customizable TS3 is, and how the creativity you can express is near limitless. You have to admit that is a huge leap of engineering, especially from the days of TS1. In TS1, you could choose a character's preset head and preset body. I mean, I can't believe that the game is too bad, it's good enough to get me to play forever. And if I get bored, there are plenty of other things to explore. You will never have explored every possibility in the game, and that's what I like about it. Tired of making solo chars? Try a challenge. Build a tomb.

You have to remember that Will Wright left of his own accord, so if someone or some contractual mumbo jumbo forced him into building games, they won't have the care put into them that you would have expected. Plus, we have virtually no proof that Will Wright would have made a better game. There is such a huge leap in technology and gameplay mechanics that you can't honestly compare TS1 from TS2 and TS3. What we do have to compare is Spore, which is a half-made game, to say the least, and honestly I don't think you'll like it if I compared the two.

So conclusion: Do I think another video game company probably could have done a better job? Probably. I can name a handful of companies that are better at managing and taking care of their franchises than EA is at TS3. Do I think Maxis specifically would have done a better job? I can't say for sure, but given the circumstances and considering they pulled out of their own accord, had they been forced to stay, then my answer is no.

[TheLB]

Actually, "that monstrosity" was created by EA basically gutting and "dumbing down" the game Will Wright was trying to create. It is one of the main reasons that Will has been doing his best to break all remaining ties with EA.This is a common fallacy that a lot of fans make.

Whenever a bad decision is made, it's the big money-hungry company's fault, but when things are going well, it's "go game designer go!" It's the same thing with World of Warcraft. Activision is a scapegoat for all the bad decisions that Blizzard makes for all the fans who can't bear to admit that Blizzard is fallible, just like any other studio.

You see, Spore is owned by and created by Maxis solely. EA's label is on the box because they published it. This means that all EA did in the creation of Spore was give Maxis the money they needed to make and market the game. Everything development-wise? That was all Maxis.

It's different in The Sims because The Sims is owned by EA, therefore EA develops the game. EA does not own Spore, they only funded the money necessary to make it.

Will Wright is not perfect, and he's old enough and fallible enough to make his own mistakes. Seriously.

TL;DR Thread needs a little less hero worship, please.

[SpaceHelicopter]

Will Wright dropped the ball like crazy with Spore. Spore was, for a lack of a better phrase, a piece of complete shit that was nothing like it was supposed to be.

And it's nobody's fault but his- because what people expected was nothing more than what he said it would be. He ran his mouth and it made the game terrible. If nothing was expected it would've been mediocre, but the world was expected and promised by Will Wright and we didn't get it.

Moreso, Wright designed The Sims, but he didn't make it. Everyone assumes his presence is what made htem like the first game, and his presence not being present is why they don't like the others. But he didn't MAKE the first game. He came up with the concept and overall design- he didn't do the little things. Much like how Karl Benz invented the automobile, that doesn't mean that he designed every single aspect of it and it doesn't mean that him not being around is the reason you think the Scion xB looks ugly. He didn't have that close of a hand in the game as people like to pretend he did- mostly because people don't understand how games are made or designed and assume "By Will Wright" means "Every single aspect of this game is a direct result of this man's opinion and input". But it wasn't.

[Pegasys2]

Speaking of the "little things..." There's one thing that few people mention or probably even think about but I think has a large impact on the experience of the games. And that's the voice acting. I think the voice acting in the Sims 2 is better - sounds more natural - than the Sims 3. In the Sims 3, they speak noticeably more slowly and carefully. The conversational flow doesn't sound as realistic to me.

The voice acting in the Sims 2 was great, in my opinion. There's a lot of enthusiasm in the voices that is very toned down in Sims 3.

[SommarBlomma]

Got TS3 just recently and haven't explored it well enough yet, but still... I expected something different.

There are the things I certainly like about the new game. The characters seem to be individualistic and goal-driven, that's very appealing to me. I like the moodlet thing as well. Adds realism. People always get good or bad impressions from what is going on with them or around them (like eating sth. yammy, being in a beautiful place, listening to good music,etc.) and I like to see my sims having these moodlets. The new traits system is cool, much better than TS2.There, your sims could basically have the same traits (neat, sociable, active, playful, and nice) developed in them to more or less extent. In TS3, two characters can be totally different, one being, let us say, childish, flirty, green thumb, loving the outdoors, and easily impressed, and the other being loner, workaholic, neat, unflirty and brave. The seamless neighborhood is great, too, and I love the outdoor plants (I spent a lot of time looking for good trees, bushes and flowers to download for TS2, because I like landscaping). And THE WATER! ITS AWESOME! In ts2, water was my biggest disappointment, together with maxis hair.

However, there are things that have already driven me nuts and made me come back to TS2, the game's unfriendliness to CC being the main reason. I hate standard hairs, I want those lovely CC hairstyles (beautiful hair is my fetish, that is why it is the 1st thing I wanted to improve in both TS2 and TS3), and though I've downloaded some cool stuff, i can't still get it appear in my game. In TS2 it was so simple! Just create a Downloads folder, always in the same location, no matter where your game is installed, and put your downloaded or self-created stuff there.

I love the new feature of creating a style, but, again, there should be more objects in each buy abd build category, and as long as I don't know how to put CC in my game, it's boring.

And how to make pretty faces in CAS? I made a male and a female, and no matter how I moved the sliders in CAS, the faces just stayed the same - chubby, and ugly. So I went into extremes, and noticed that the faces got thinner and more sophisticated, However, when I moved my sims onto the lot, I figured out that i created monsters with sunken cheeks, unnormal chins and ugly mouths, though they looked totally different in CAS.
I looked through Sunset Valley and Twinbrook to find some good-looking sims and I found just a few ones. Others are plain ugly fat redneck-looking things. I need beautiful characters to get attached to, I failed at making my own ones, so I downloaded a bunch of sims, but... back to the main problem, I can't install them.

And rabbit holes... yes, nobody would be interested in seeng their sims working in the office, so some of RH:s do make sense. However, I want to make my own restaurants, and to decorate them the way I like, and then to send my sims there; to build shops and make shopping such detailed as it was in TS2; it would also be cool to see the sims when they attend all those classess (to see them learning to play guitar, or painting, or any other skill together with fellow sims).

Well, to say sth. positive in the end, I like that there are no "townies" (or maybe I just haven't noticed them?). Everybody lives somwhere, I can visit their houses, customize them (hpuses and sims), and it is cool. In TS2, I always kill those folks that come from noone-knows-where, often look ugly, have stupid names and pop up everywhere to spoil my screenshots taken on community lots :) .

If the stuff I mentioned as anoyng was fixed, I'd be completely happy with TS3. But now I feel more like playing TS2...and missing those TS3 beautiful sceneries.

[oreosncreamforjojo]

I wish Maxis had made the sims 3. I really miss some features which are gone. I miss being able to bathe toddlers and babies and have two people play a video game TOGETHER which is no longer possible. There are no more 'group activities' or 'family games' I also dislike that it is now harder for people to make mods. Especially when Im trying to create videos. In the sims 2 you could set an object to 'dirty' in the sims 3 I have to spend time having a sim make it dirty.

MOST OF ALL I miss The Reactions Tester which was my video making companion.

[karrie85]

I came across this thread today, and read all five pages, every last post, and it made me wonder where all the negativity is really coming from. So, I thought I'd put in my two sense. Some may not like it, but well, not everyone is going to like everything everyone will say.

Now, right away, I am going to come out and flat out say that The Sims 2, and The Sims 3 are two entirely different games in both look, feel, and gameplay. With that being said, even though they are both of the same 'series' I honestly think there is no real way to say one is better than the other. However, since they are linked through the title of the game, no matter what I say or think, people are still going to compare and contrast.

So let's look at The Sims 3 in comparison of The Sims 2. With The Sims 2 you are more in control of each and every sim whereas in The Sims 3, the game takes care of a lot of that for you. So really, that alone can change your opinion on whether you like the game or not because if you are a control freak who has to have every last thing in the game under their command, then The Sims 2 is really going to be the game for you.

I really don't have anything bad to say about either game. I have some frustrations with both. In The Sims 2, I hated the loading screens and the fact that you can't visit your friends unless you live in an apartment. I would go to the extremes of making large apartment lots as 'mini neighborhoods' that would take forever to load up. However, when you play The Sims 3, that isn't a problem. Want to visit your friend? Just walk there or take a cab or drive. Simple.

With The Sims 3, I've noticed some frustrations as well. For once, to me it seems as if it's harder to keep my sim in the green (needs). I'm not sure why this is but it seems like any little task takes all their needs down and I have to make them stuff their face, wash their hands (several times), and pee while on a community lot. Does this kill the game? Hardly. I get passed it because there are lots of things in the game that The Sims 2 didn't have.

Like I said earlier about The Sims 2 being more controlled. For me, I simply don't have all the time, nor patience, to sync up a neighborhood that I am playing, and going around aging all the sims. I only get to play the sims mostly at night when I have spare time before bed, or during the day when I don't have a busy agenda. Having to spend all that time aging all the sims in the hood, including ones that bore me to death, is just nervewracking. The Sims 3 takes care of that for me with a simple option. And the fact that it's just that, an option, is even greater.

Other things I've seen listed on here liked the voice work in The Sims 3, and the fat faces of the sims, I somewhat agree with them. I did like the voices in The Sims 2 a little better, but I usually play with the volume off and my own music on, so it's not really a problem. And the faces.. call me crazy but I think they are cute. With The Sims 2 I downloaded SO much CC because I wanted to make all my sims realistic but mostly DIFFERENT. With The Sims 3 I realized I don't need CC because now I can have my sims look different without it. Maybe their faces might look the same, but hey, it doesn't bother me that Sims have the same haircut when I can have endless shades of blondes in it. Because realistically, in real life, you're gonna find people in the mall with you that have the same hair cut.

I don't think the Sims 3 is as bad as people think. I enjoy it. It's really different from The Sims 2 and with the guided gameplay it offers, it keeps me more interested. I use to get bored often with The Sims 2 because I just felt like I was sitting there playing barbies endlessly. With The Sims 3 it offers more of an RPG kinda feel to it. Realistically, the graphics aren't 'better' but they are cute and fun. I like playing with pudgy face dolls in a neighborhood that moves and ages with my sim. It's fun, keeps me interested, and I don't have to spend extra time doing boring in game chores.

So in answer to the question of the thread, do I think Maxis would have made a better game? No. I don't. Why? Because to me, The Sims is more of an actual game than Sims 2 ever was. Sims 2 felt more of like an open play doll house that gets really really boring after playing too long.

[suzetter]

This is a common fallacy that a lot of fans make.

Whenever a bad decision is made, it's the big money-hungry company's fault, but when things are going well, it's "go game designer go!" It's the same thing with World of Warcraft. Activision is a scapegoat for all the bad decisions that Blizzard makes for all the fans who can't bear to admit that Blizzard is fallible, just like any other studio.

You see, Spore is owned by and created by Maxis solely. EA's label is on the box because they published it. This means that all EA did in the creation of Spore was give Maxis the money they needed to make and market the game. Everything development-wise? That was all Maxis.

It's different in The Sims because The Sims is owned by EA, therefore EA develops the game. EA does not own Spore, they only funded the money necessary to make it.

Will Wright is not perfect, and he's old enough and fallible enough to make his own mistakes. Seriously.

TL;DR Thread needs a little less hero worship, please.

FYI, Maxis is subsidiary of EA. They bought it a long tiime ago. So EA doesn't just give Maxis Money--they are Maxis.

Spore is a different game so has no bearing on the question of this thread.

What this thread needs is less EA cheerleaders. Seriously.

...Moreso, Wright designed The Sims, but he didn't make it...He came up with the concept and overall design- he didn't do the little things...

Come again?

Read the thread again--most of the dissatisfaction expressed is about how the sims is being moved away its unique original concept --a game genre unto itself--and being bombarded with the more pedestrian play elements found in every other game out there.

One can only conclude you both feel Maxis would not have made a better TS3 because you were disappointed by Spore--a very different game. :wtf:

However, you could also conclude because Spore sucks than EA sucks because they own Maxis.

Anyway, the comparison is really about the Maxis TS1 development team (game was already developed before EA bought Maxis) vs. the TS3 EA development team.

[abiridaught]

However, there are things that have already driven me nuts and made me come back to TS2, the game's unfriendliness to CC being the main reason. I hate standard hairs, I want those lovely CC hairstyles (beautiful hair is my fetish, that is why it is the 1st thing I wanted to improve in both TS2 and TS3), and though I've downloaded some cool stuff, i can't still get it appear in my game. In TS2 it was so simple! Just create a Downloads folder, always in the same location, no matter where your game is installed, and put your downloaded or self-created stuff there.

I have to disagree with you, there. I was a die-hard TS2 fan, and played it for years. And I never had one ounce of cc, because I couldn't figure the damned thing out. TS3 was the first time I've ever had my cc show up in game. Ever. After numerous failed attempts.

I, too, have a hair fetish, and the first thing I did when I saw my default options was high tail it to MTS and download tons of cc. :rofl:

I really enjoyed TS3, because I took it for what it was; a step in a different direction. I didn't expect it to be the same as TS2, I kept myself open-minded, and I've really found myself enjoying my sims. The game is not without its flaws, though. I don't lose track of time the way I did on TS2, and it takes a lot more work on my part to become attached to my sims, but it does eventually happen.

The first time I played the game, I literally went from playing TS2 hours before, uninstalling (that damn near broke my heart), and installing TS3. I played for 20 minutes and remember slumping over and saying, "you've got to be kidding me..." I called my boyfriend and complaaaiiined about it. And then I went back inside, fiddled around with it more, and didn't get off for 6 hours. I was hooked. :rolleyes:

So, while I do agree with some of the things you said, I just felt like I had to (kindly) disagree. :)

[Nvenya]

I believe if Sims 3 was created/developed/imagined by Will Wright then it would be different. I don't necessarily know if it would be better. Of course I also don't think Sims 3 would exist if it depended on him to create it since he is known for not liking sequels and prefers trying new concepts. The big difference between Wright and EA is that Wright is an advocate for the player/gamer creating their own unique content and having more control over their game. I really wish that EA had kept to that idea when creating Sims 3.

@SpaceHelicopter - I don't quite understand your logic. Wright was entirely responsible for the fail that is Spore, but wasn't entirely responsible for the success of The Sims? I believe Wright came up with both concepts with the help of his team. Unlike with The Sims game, however, I'm not entirely certain how much control he ultimately had over the creation of Spore.

[TUN3R]

Yes I think it would have. Black Box gets alot of pressure from EA and it's bad for business.

[rosieposiepudnpie]

Sims 3 can be boring. Other than CAS (which is the only thing that kept me with Sims 3), the Sims 3 is very boring. No more making huge families for me. No children at all. The game is too predictable. Nothing happens, like in even the 1st Sims, tragedy hit everyone. Nothing happens in the Sims 3. It can be boring. I never play the Sims 3 for as long as I did one and two. I am not a happy customer for the over all. Like is said before, I like that I don’t have to download a ton of things to get different looks in my game. But that is the only thing I like about it.
:bunny:

[Kirlay]

Sims 2 and 3 are really different. I enjoyed Sims 2, the first time I ever played the Sims was the Sims 2 for Playstation 2. I liked it so much I ended up getting it for my PC. I played it a lot and ended up getting really attached to the families, I loved watching them interact and be quirky and make memories and ultimately I could give them their own stories. However, I hated that they died so much! There was a lot of saving. One time I'd literally just made a family and I sent the kid out to use the teloscope... and Bam! hit by a meteor. I also did not like the non-open world. When I go to play MMOs or other games, one of the things I look for is open worlds, but Sims 2 didn't have that. But thankfully it had enough features to keep me interested regardless of that.
When I first played Sims 3, I was hooked. I love CAS, because it means I can make my Sims or houses that much more unique, but it often leads to me getting carried away and spending way to much time creating just one sim. I love that my Sim can just go run over to his/her neighbours house and socialize. I love moodlets and traits (even though there should be more IMO.) But having my Sims interact with eachother isn't as entertaining. I think it takes much too long to get from acquaintance to friend, and I usually end up cheating to lessen the time. And raising kids and toddlers is a chore. I usually have my sims lifespans set to long/epic or aging off so younger sims get boring very fast.
All in all though, there are aspects in each version that shine. I wish I could see a more Maxis sims, but I'm still content with EA's version.

[jeffallenroberts]

I have to say that I think TS3 would have been a better game if Will and the Maxis team had developed it. TS3 has no soul at all. TS2 has plenty of soul. I care about TS2 sims a great deal, they have personality. Not so with TS3. I've had (past tense) a good time playing TS3, but the sims I've played never grew on me. After I've played them I don't care about abandoning them, or remember them as individuals. The goal driven play doesn't bother me, I like some of it, but the sims involve don't matter. Meanwhile, back in TS2 they do. I've abandoned a project to create and share an OFB suburb because I can't bear destroying the test play attached to Veronaville. The sims MATTER to me, all of them--even the "villains". I've got to play out the story to the end. Maxis gave us characters that interact with the world around them in quirky ways, EA gives us automations that have to be forced to do anything interesting at all.

[Laisanae]

I have to say that I think TS3 would have been a better game if Will and the Maxis team had developed it. TS3 has no soul at all. TS2 has plenty of soul. I care about TS2 sims a great deal, they have personality. Not so with TS3. I've had (past tense) a good time playing TS3, but the sims I've played never grew on me. After I've played them I don't care about abandoning them, or remember them as individuals. The goal driven play doesn't bother me, I like some of it, but the sims involve don't matter. Meanwhile, back in TS2 they do. I've abandoned a project to create and share an OFB suburb because I can't bear destroying the test play attached to Veronaville. The sims MATTER to me, all of them--even the "villains". I've got to play out the story to the end. Maxis gave us characters that interact with the world around them in quirky ways, EA gives us automations that have to be forced to do anything interesting at all.


Strange, I never got attached to my TS2 sims, though I played with it a lot. But with my TS3 family... no, the whole neighborhood, I never ever want them to age and die.

[JasonD88]

As for myself, The base game was very bland. I mean come on, how many people was eager for World Adventures to come out?? Like the post above, the game doesnt have soul or depth to it as much as it did in sims 2. I mean dont take me as negative as the gardening feature I absolutely love, traits system is good but look at their first two expansion packs, very linear and repetitve which is why loads of us warmed to Late Night.

The chubby faces annoyed me like mad but the options allowed me to make my own sim by squishing its features to look "normal" and the best thing EA did was to take away the loading screens..yay.

Sims 2 was a piece of art.

[Shoosh Malooka]

A Maxis Sims 3 would have included clothing from different cultures and periods of time, obscenely garish 'style' clothing as would be worn by vancome ladies and midwest hipsters, and even more ridiculous choices such as purple gorilla suits and deep sea diving equipment. They would have walked passed wacky and shook hands with wacky's older brother, Ed, who puts his mongoose on spin dry so that it can produce static electricity to kill all the moths that are hogging the clock and preventing Elvis from leaving.

http://thumbs2.modthesims.info/img/3/1/1/1/2/0/1/MTS2_Shoosh_Malooka_1179109_Maxis_Party.jpg

Compared to TS1, the attitude of TS3 is too realistic.

[tryguy]

Wow, I SO miss playing Sims 1!! I may have to reinstall it. I know the graphics suck, but when you start playing, they're suddenly not so bad. I should really get into Sims 2 again as well.

[pinimon162]

Wow, I SO miss playing Sims 1!! I may have to reinstall it. I know the graphics suck, but when you start playing, they're suddenly not so bad. I should really get into Sims 2 again as well.

Graphics can only do so much if you're not into the gameplay. I think the landscapes in Sims 3 are amazing and even on a laptop the houses the neighbourhood look a lot better in comparison to Sims 2, however I still love my Sims 2 neighbourhoods because I care about them.

I'm not going to go into more about sims 2/sims 3 because there's a whole other thread for that even though some aspects of it overlap with this thread.

What I would say though, is that I do feel a maxis Sims 3 would have been better. I know there's a bit of confusion about whether Maxis are EA, or if they exist, etc..but in terms of the people behind the game and not the company name, I remember watching Sims 2 walkthroughs and preview diaries with the game creators and they seemed so inspired and into the game as they talked about how they could play it for hours and discover things they didn't even know could happen!

A lot of people mention this charm that TS1 and TS2 has.. particularly TS1 and early Sims 2 rather than the later expansions where it is evident there are new people onboard and the game feels different. This can be taken to be nostalgia, and some of it maybe is. However, I strongly remember playing The Sims for the first time and getting that feeling that it was a special game..it's an odd sort of thing to describe and you can't really put your finger on what it is, but the best I can express it is just all the little quirks and unexpected things such as the random phone calls. It was like a bunch of people had just been really imaginative and creative with it, and I feel this has been lost from Sims 3. Where there are 'quirks', it feels forced to me personally.

Nobody can really tell how a maxis sims 3 would've played out, but I get a sense that the old team really loved the game and enjoyed sharing it..I don't get that from EA/Sims 3 as we have to pay for things on the sims store, and made to download things such as the EA download manager in order to enjoy a patched game.

Also, I'm not just saying this because I'm not into Sims 3. I don't mind the game, and really tried it, it's just not for me. There's just a different feel to it. I also think the Sims 2 feels different in the later EPs, I think in AL especially it's evident that they were already thinking about Sims 3 if you look at the parks in Belladonna Cove for example, with the roads that cross over to other lots, from neighbourhood view it looks like the sims 3 park, as if you can just walk right across from one lot to another.

[CherrySim]

Was The Sims Bustin' Out a Maxis game? It just seems alot better than some of the other games.

[pinimon162]

Was The Sims Bustin' Out a Maxis game? It just seems alot better than some of the other games.

Yes I believe it was..at least the Maxis logo popped up when you loaded the game.
Bustin' Out is one of my favourite games ever..it's much better than Sims 2 for consoles was, which says a lot I think. And so many funny things used to happen!

[WoohooAndTheCity]

Will Wright needs to come back and save us.

[manunit99]

The original Sims game both on PC and consoles had brilliant voice actors. I remember we all used to mimic them in school back in the day. They were more dramatic and funny but since then its been to realistic and boring. That was one of the many charm aspects of the original and also the music was awesome. You could never get tired of the music but I absolutely hate the Sims 3 music. It also had way more objects and clothing which lets face it is the main reason we buy expansions. Also the objects had more interactions and animations. The Sims 3 sucks in comparison I feel sorry for those that didn't experience the original when it first came out. So what if we can explore our neighborhoods? I don't want to watch a stupid rabithole all day!

[Ghost sdoj]

Actually, I very quickly got tired of the build/buy music in the original sims until I got a lot in Magic Town. I liked that music. I get tired of this music, too, but at least it has more variety. (Why can't we make custom music channels for that, too?)

As for the clothing and objects, you're comparing a finished game to one that still has more EPs and SPs coming out. Of course the finished game has more objects and clothing. You said it yourself; the objects and clothing are what sells the EPs and SPs.

And rabbitholes have been with us since the beginning. They just weren't quite as obvious when you sim got into the carpool and went to work. Now that you can have the sim's wife go past where her husband works on her own way to work, the rabbithole had to shrink from the entire rest of the world to just a building. (But it would have been nice if the ones that hadn't originally been rabbitholes hadn't been turned into them. It makes rabbithole buildings feel like a step backward.)

What is missing in the later sim games is the innocent sense of humor and the fact that your sims are limited by your imagination more than by the extra additions that the game gives them. And "what if your garden gnome gets into your wine vat and gets drunk?" is a lot funnier when it keeps happening than "What if the candles on a birthday cake burn the house down? Even when it's for a baby turning into a toddler" (The jealous or drunk garden gnomes were easier to prevent if you didn't want it happening, too.)

You can't blame them for giving us realistic, when so many people have been complaining that "It's not realistic for someone who is about to die of hunger to stop cooking a meal so that they can complain about being hungry" or "Who gives a noogie to their grandmother?" We wanted the extra realism of teens. In Sims 2 we started wanting the extra realism of sims who actually do want (and try to achieve) what they say they want. So we get more realism.

But it feels to me as though their sense of humor is getting darker, and they still haven't quite figured out what they are making. Or maybe they just lost their vision of the game and started to focus too much on the bottom line. Yes, I know they need to keep production cost-effective. But if you have to many people working on a game that is just a paycheck, you will not have as good a game as when you have everybody having fun with the game, and then sending it out for other people to have fun playing it.

[Kathwynn]

Having seen and played Spore.. The only way a Maxis could make a better sims 3 game. Would for me to learn programming. Make and build my own sims type game. Every one rip it apart as the worse clone since the Artari ET game. Which was not a clone, but was buried in the New Mexico desert as land fill. I just dated myself...

Have every one congratulate Maxis for having the foresight for moving on to other projects. Tell Ea they are Gods for building a better game. Yea, That would be my way for Maxis make a better Sims3 game.... ROFL

[Miko09]

After seeing the direction Maxis is going, I can't sit here and say that a Sims 3 game headed by Maxis would be better. The only game Maxis has going for them at the moment is Spore. Spore isnt a bad game, but I personally would say that it differs a lot from the "traditional" sim formula. Maxis has dropped all work on other monopolies like SimCity and the like to produce just Spore material. Maxis only released one game this year, Darkspore, and that brought in pretty mixed reviews.

[lisfyre]

As a late player to The Sims franchise, I couldn't really tell the difference. I never played The Sims original game and I started playing The Sims 2 in December 2007 which was the tail end of that franchise. I have been very lucky ~~knocks on wood~~ that I never had any problems in The Sims 2 - no glitches, no crashes, no lag. I never had hacks in that game but tons and tons of CC. I bought the EP's (except Pets and University) and some SP's (H&M, Glamour and Hoiday). I was happy playing that game.

In The Sims 3, I have Base + WA + AMB + LN and I have experienced no crashes, glitches, lag, errors, black lots... and whatever else has happened to most people. I am fully patched and the only "huge" problem I have experienced to date is one of my families on vacation in France came back home and found clones of themselves in their home.

So the question is... would it make a difference if Maxis had made Sims 2 and 3 as opposed to EA? I can't tell... both games are unique and play differently. I like them both.

[CowPlantsForHire]

Would the game have been better? That's debateable. Would it have been different? Well, I think the game would share similarities to the actual product, but certain aspects would have been changed, added, or removed. Now what those aspects are, I can't say for sure. I haven't played all of the games and/or played them as long as everyone else who'd posted in this thread did. I played The Sims over six years ago when The Sims 2 was less than a year old, and I only had one expansion pack throughout the entire time I played that game!

Besides, everyone else pretty much covered everything that you could say about this subject. Ah, well, I'm always late to these parties, especially when it comes to The Sims. :faceslap:

Alley Gaytor: Look up at the sky. Is it the rare species, the Flying Llama? A plane? No, it's Super Wright!!!
He's dressed in a skin-tight bodysuit (it's so tight, it's like he's wearing a second skin) with a giant SW sewn on the chest, an eyemask to conceal his identity, a long, flowing cape, and three inch, high-heeled, leather boots. He is not to be confused with or compared to SuperMan. :rofl:

I'm sorry for going off topic, but I couldn't resist not making that joke.